elle88

as per title...it happened...luckily just in reverse taking the car out of the garage...
i know that hardcore guys will say to go for Tom's 31 spline... but what's instead the best option staying with the standard axle? is it Tom's 1541 axle kav-oda ? other options ?
the car is not a daily driver indeed.... 500hp , 4.11 rear , Avon race tires...
but ...just thinking that it's better that i stop hammering on it ... now the outer axles...and then ? it will be the inner axles...then the differential...then the transmission...
advises and above all various driveline issues with stock parts welcome...just to understand what will brake next

p.s. even if quite powerful...actually because of the ZL1 cam , the low end torque is low. M21 close ratio, so reduced shock during shift . let's say that at the end the stress on driveline on my car is not as much....if compared to other modded vettes

bfit

There are a lot of stock rear ends out there with good HP up front and still holding together.
I know a few who have broken toms axles . its just a matter of time and traction.

redvetracr

shipping sounds expensive but I have a brand new genuine GM rear spindle in most of the GM box, if you or anyone else is interested send a PM.

gkull

My original outers never broke I just replaced them with Tom's I think 17 spline. I was inspecting them at the end of drag racing season when I had the half shafts out to replace worn out u joints. What I saw scared me. The outer splines we almost rotated a full spline width. I don't think that it was that long before they would have twist off.

383 , slicks, and 700r4 that just instantly banged gear changes. 4.11 rear end

I already had 17 spline $400 yokes and Tom's stage 7 posi unit. 500# rear steel spring and smart struts. I bought the Tom's outers and HD swing arms

427Hotrod

I broke several outers with my 427 and then later the 540. I put Tom's in there....but went a little overboard.

I never hurt a halfshaft or inner shaft and I used Spicer solid joints. Worked well for a long time even on slicks.


My buddy with a mild 327 broke an outer also. It's all about traction. He broke several differentials and outers etc until we dropped in a 525HP 388" engine. Now he spins tires forever but hasn't broken anything in years!

JIM

elle88

gkull . which had splines rotated ? oem or Tom's 17?

elle88

i dont understand...your friend broke everything with a mild 327 and nothing with a 525hp? i suppose because he more easily spins tires with more horses....if so i suppose he uses normal tires...
i think it's a different story with sticky race tires ( like mine)

elle88

to those who broke the spindle...anybody at speed? just wondering how dangerous is such kind of failure...what happens to the car in such situation?
it happened to me just doing a reverse. and the wheel was stuck . i suppose that at speed the wheel would continue to turn...but car would go straight?

gkull

OEM what came on my 79 they really took a beating for many years. I'm trying to think about how long they lasted. Maybe 15 years the yokes and rear end were trash in about 8 years with 355 ci and apro built th350.

the rage was the 700r4 od back then a 700r4 uses more hp and bad gear spacing so I installed a 4.11. The outers lasted many years until I did the Goodyear 10X28 slicks and was doing the whole drag racing series with the 11.70s 383 ci motor

the OEM from redvettercr could last a long time

gkull

As for your question about dangerous. I had vb&p smart struts and a 500#rear steel custom spring the outside u joints broke and the half shaft was whipping around I heard the noise and stomped on the brake. You don't lose control because of the strut, trailing arm and to a lesser extent the rear spring bolt

that is why you need the half shafts cages for racing. I was always wondered about the drive shaft rpm also. So I caged the drive shaft

elle88

and now....whats the best axle wanting to stay with the standard 17 splines?opinions?
OEM ? or Tom's differential 17 splines is supposed to be better?

i cant install spindles by myself . i must install the whole assembly on both sides, L and R .

i have 2 options right now
1) having Gary Ramadei doing the job and choose parts. but he is super busy...i fear a too long timing
2) buying on ebay a ready set from a vendor that seems to have a good reputation ( Harvey Jacobs) . these are readily available. price is OK . just...he says he uses reconditioned oem spindles. here is description : REBUILD INCLUDES NEW TIMKEN BEARINGS, NEW SEALS , NEW STAINLESS STEEL PARKING BRAKE HARDWARE, NEW PARKING BRAKE SHOES ALREADY INSTALLED , NEW BACKING PLATE, NEW AXLE WHEEL STUDS , , THE AXLE SPINDLE HAS BEEN REFACED TO HAVE ZERO RUN OUT. THE END PLAY TOLERANCE HAS BEEN SET TO G.M. SPECS.

i must admit that my OEM spindles lasted many years.... just wonder if reconditioned oem would be fine. i suppose that if splines are straight and not turned ...if no signs of cracks...could be ok...

76strokervette

Jo Watt has re-ordered parts and I believe may have them in stock.
With sticky tires I recommend upgrading to the 31 spline outer.
It may also be a good time to check the rest of the differential out while you have it apart.

redvetracr

I have this one available, NOS (brand new) in the box, genuine GM not GM/China, bought as a spare for my vintage racer and never used, if you or anyone else is interested send a PM

elle88

searched better the forum and found this from Traccdog2 . i report here because it may be useful for other members too:

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Here's the problem with 17 spline stub axles. They're too small. This is why Tom doesn't recommend them. They will always break in the splines. The stock originals (pre 1974) will handle 500 hp no problem. They will not handle the shock load from a hard launch.
Here's the story of two cars. Both are 71's with stock stub axles. 71A has a 496 BB auto 650hp/700tq. 71B has a 355 4spd 350hp/400tq. 71A launches hard and gets a little air under the front tires. Did not twist the stub axles. 71b launches hard and does twist the stub axles.
Here's a 3rd car, 76. BB auto. over 300 passes on stock replacement stub axles. One bad launch twisted everything including the stub axles but they didn't break. The ring gear shattered because of bearing cap stretch. All 3 now run 30 spline stub axles.
All the (HD) stub axles I see on the market have a modified end for u-joint retention. Where they never break at. They advertise twice the Rockwell hardness (or more) of a stock OE stub axle. But they don't give the actual number. Stock midyear HD stub axles Rockwell in the mid 20's. Twice that puts them near 50. Very hard but brittle. They will handle the torque but not the shock load. Late 70's Rockwell in the single digits. Even at twice the hardness they don't come close to an OEM midyear axle.
Inferior stub axles that have flooded the market: Cagotzmann has witnessed them first hand. These have the torque resistance of a tootsie roll. And that's what they look like when they break. There is only one way to identify them and I wouldn't be surprised if that gets changed soon.
80-82 Dana 44 OEM stub axles. These are so soft you can whittle on them with a sharp knife. But they don't twist, even in 10 second cars. Because they are 30 spline.
Only one company makes a decent 17 spline replacement stub axle at a decent price. It rockwells right at 30. Stronger than any OEM but soft enough not to snap off. But it has its limits because of the 17 splines. There just isn't a 17 spline axle that's going to hold up to clutch dumps on slicks. Not even Toms.
Mike

elle88

about me ... i am in touch with Gary gtr1999 and he suggests , wanting to keep 17 splines axles...to go for Spencer Forge spindles and take away race tires going back to street tires

i will keep race tires anyway. they hold great in turns and braking...no way i can go back to BFG or such... i just will not beat the car anymore in first gear etc... easy on it

but where to get these Spencer Forge? i went to their website and no pricing or catalog . Gtr 1999 knows for sure... but any more info from members is welcome