When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
I think you guys are missing the reason the column collapses and how it does. It can be as free as possible with no degradation to safety. The reason it collapses is so in a major front end wreck, the shaft isn't speared through your chest as the spokes bend back and turn into hook barbs locking into your ribs. It can't be too loose. The column is bolted to a big bracket and the firewall, so it is well supported.
Also, here's another problem I haven't seen mentioned about the R&P. The Grand Am one I see being used is designed for the tie rods to be long and bolted to the middle if the unit. THat big bracket used to connect to the shorter C3 tie rods puts a lot of side loads on the R&B bushings that they were not designed to handle. It's just a crappy design anyway you to justify it.
I haven't got the car back together to drive it, but other than the cheeze grade bolts that came to mount the unit (I threw in the trash and used Grade 8 fine with distorted thread flange nuts) this thing went in cleanly and is the way to upgrade the 4 turn LTL 1950's power steering unit.
I'm in the middle of my install and would like to add a few things I didn't see in this thread. Even after pulling the column from the car I simply could not get the shaft to collapse. I ran across Jim Shea's papers and saw reference to corroded bearing and that led me to some deeper digging here on the forum. I found another thread on here that helped me out:
I had to pull the column from the car and cut the frozen bearing off with a dremel. PB Blaster simply didn't do it for me. Once I had that lower bearing cut off the shaft tapped in easily. It seems I got the worst possible outcome here.
I'm also having a bit of trouble getting that Borgeson rag joint on the column end. I took the dremel to the splines by the flat side of the shaft and that helped but it's going to need some more help with a BFH to get it to fully seat. I am looking forward to getting that new bearing in the mail so I can move forward and enjoy the results. Even though I may have had the only one that didn't leak my old box was just plain dangerous! I am hoping that this could be the best mod that I've done yet.
You are not the only one :
I to had to dremel the splines, keep at it, it only takes a minimal amount to easily slide the coupling on.
As I was assembling the column the ragjoint butted up the borgeson box causing the shaft to collapse too far, but once the column was bolted down it was very easy to slide it back out and on to the box's shaft.
Nick
You can use a fine or medium wire wheel on a drill to clean the splines. I have used a right angle drill - M12 Milwaukee + a 2" wire wheel (harbor freight) and lightly polish the splined , it will clean and polish the end. The rag joint then slid on easy..
I just helped a friend do another one. This time I used a pry bar in the dis-assembled old rag joint to move the column up before taking the steering box out - it worked well.
Again we soaked the shaft for a few days with PB Blaster and Freeze off to free things up. Made it easy...
I have over a year on my rag joint with no issues. just as info..
I have hooker long tube headers and have no clearance issues. I can run my finger all around the box.
Once I got the column collapsed, and the measurement was really close, I took the rag joint apart.
It is pretty easy to mount the two halves of the rag joint to the column and the box. Then I loosely mounted the box in place, and bolted the rag joint back together.
Make sure you have it aligned pretty close before trying to bolt the two halves back together.
I didn't worry at all about the steering column simply because I took off the steering wheel and realigned it when the job was over.
I had to use the little adaptors on the box for the lines. Also, be prepared to really tighten down on those hoses, both on the steering pump and the box. I found that mine were totally leak free when the big vein in my neck stood up. Vein torque wrench
Oh yeah, one final tip. The hose clamp that comes with the kit for attaching to the power steering pump is too small. You will need a slightly larger one. Make sure you have it when you start otherwise you'll be hunting for one or wasting a lot time trying to get the small one to fit.
when you lined up the steering wheel do the blinkers cancel correctly ??
im wondering if we got an answer to this... Im almost done with my install... the steering wheel ended up a little ways off.. my plan was to pull the hub and move the wheel when im done...
did this work to straighten steering wheel ? did it effect the blinkers from canceling ?
when you lined up the steering wheel do the blinkers cancel correctly ??
beingst that you're quoting a post from 2014, I'm going to take the liberty to jump in here.
I installed the Borgeson PS box in my 78 a few months back. I didn't like the excessive tolerance of the bolt holes in the Borgeson-supplied rag joint flanges, so I re-used the GM original rag-joint half from the column side, and mated that with the Borgeson half for the gear box side, had to drill out one of the bolt holes in the GM flange, but the tolerance is so much tighter. I also preferred how the GM cross-bolt lines up with the flat on the column shaft as the method to retain the flange. I also loosened up the steering column on the inside of the car to help align the 2 shaft ends: the 2 bolts under the instrument cluster, and the nuts on the floor board (can't remember if there were 2 or 3). When I initially bolted the Borgeson box to the frame, the shaft ends were nowhere near close to being in-line, so that was a necessity.
Anyways, after bolting it up, with the road wheels point straight front ahead, using a 8FT straight edge to line up the front wheels with the rear wheels, the steering wheel was way off. I think it was about maybe 120 degrees, more than 90, but less than 180, recollection is fuzzy. So I pulled the steering wheel hub (adapter) and lined it up, reassembling the tlit-tele stuff, horn contact, so that the steering wheel is straight up when going straight. That part came out really good.
I was worried about turn signal cancellation. But sofar in driving it around town, running errands, changing lanes on the freeway, etc, it hasn't been a problem. yes, one direction cancels sooner than the other, but it isn't a problem at all, not even sure if it's noticeable, and it's been a few months, no issues. At least, that's my humble opinion.
Only thing I'm concerned about is running a ground strap across the rag joint since I don't think the Borgeson rag joint rubber coupling is wire mesh impregnated, but the horn works fine. It's not recommended practice to use bearings (ball, needle, or sleeve) as an electrical conductor.
beingst that you're quoting a post from 2014, I'm going to take the liberty to jump in here.
I installed the Borgeson PS box in my 78 a few months back. I didn't like the excessive tolerance of the bolt holes in the Borgeson-supplied rag joint flanges, so I re-used the GM original rag-joint half from the column side, and mated that with the Borgeson half for the gear box side, had to drill out one of the bolt holes in the GM flange, but the tolerance is so much tighter. I also preferred how the GM cross-bolt lines up with the flat on the column shaft as the method to retain the flange. I also loosened up the steering column on the inside of the car to help align the 2 shaft ends: the 2 bolts under the instrument cluster, and the nuts on the floor board (can't remember if there were 2 or 3). When I initially bolted the Borgeson box to the frame, the shaft ends were nowhere near close to being in-line, so that was a necessity.
Anyways, after bolting it up, with the road wheels point straight front ahead, using a 8FT straight edge to line up the front wheels with the rear wheels, the steering wheel was way off. I think it was about maybe 120 degrees, more than 90, but less than 180. So I pulled the steering wheel hub (adapter) and lined it up, reassembling the tlit-tele stuff, horn contact, so that the steering wheel is straight up when going straight. That part came out really good.
I was worried about turn signal cancellation. But sofar in driving it around town, running errands, changing lanes on the freeway, etc, it hasn't been a problem. yes, one direction cancels sooner than the other, but it isn't a problem at all, not even sure if it's noticeable, and it's been a few months, no issues. At least, that's my humble opinion.
Only thing I'm concerned about is running a ground strap across the rag joint since I don't think the Borgeson rag joint rubber coupling is wire mesh impregnated, but the horn works fine. It's not recommended practice to use bearings (ball, needle, or sleeve) as an electrical conductor.
hope this helps.
thanks for the reply I cannot get the borgeson rag joint flange to fit on the column shaft. so im using the factory column flange on my column also. and I had to drill one hole bigger same as you did. but my concern in doing it like this is my blinkers canceling correctly. if they don't cancel correctly im going to have the get the borgeson colum side flange to fit my column shaft. I see where some guys stated they had to Dremel the column shaft to get the borgeson flange to fit the column shaft. or buy a different brand rag joint ? thanks jp
thanks for the reply I cannot get the borgeson rag joint flange to fit on the column shaft. so im using the factory column flange on my column also. and I had to drill one hole bigger same as you did. but my concern in doing it like this is my blinkers canceling correctly. if they don't cancel correctly im going to have the get the borgeson colum side flange to fit my column shaft. I see where some guys stated they had to Dremel the column shaft to get the borgeson flange to fit the column shaft. or buy a different brand rag joint ? thanks jp
if I coluld get the borgeson flange on my column shaft I could time it like this one in the pic and the teering wheel would be clocking like it did from the factory and blinker canceling would be correct also.
no beating on the shaft for me, i just could not get into a good position to hit,(and I am not a fan of beating things on cars) so got my trusty screw jack from one of my old 4runners, lined it up with whatever it took to be straight and turned the screw and in the shaft went easy and smooth. I did have to dent my header cause the rag joint just touched when driving,I thought something was really wrong,freaked me out with the steering locking up, like WTF, after denting the header, all is good. Kinda neutral on the upgrade, but on the positive, the power steering leaks are gone
no beating on the shaft for me, i just could not get into a good position to hit,(and I am not a fan of beating things on cars) so got my trusty screw jack from one of my old 4runners, lined it up with whatever it took to be straight and turned the screw and in the shaft went easy and smooth. I did have to dent my header cause the rag joint just touched when driving,I thought something was really wrong, freaked me out with the steering locking up, like WTF, after denting the header, all is good. Kinda neutral on the upgrade, but on the positive, the power steering leaks are gone
you had to dent-tune your headers? just curious, SBC? BBC? side-pipes?
I used the old column flange and clocked it where it needed to be for the steering wheel to be straight and the blinkers cancel correctly now. and I had to grind a new flat spot for the pinch bolt. and now I can move flange on shaft real easy to get it in the correct position. and all is good now. the borgeson flange is a real tight fit and once its on the shaft there was no adjusting it without a hammer that's why I used the factory flange. now I just need to mount the new column.
looking at your pic, I hope that's not regular grade braided stainless hose? especially on the high-pressure side. needs to be rated for up to 1200 psi, and also formulated for power steering fluid, which will degrade and seep through regular automotive rubber hose (e.g. fuel, water, oil rated). I went with the Earls braided steel teflon lined for my HP side, although the Earls PS-specific hose has a higher pressure rating. and with the regular old PS return hose from the the gearbox to the reservoir. I tried to use the Earls blue PS-specific hose for the return line, but couldn't get it to fit over the hose nipple on the steel pipe on the PS pump reservoir. very frustrating. so had to go with regular automotive grade, but still PS fluid specific.
regardless, glad you got it all bolted together and hooked up. I was reluctant to file a flat on my factory column end, so had to work with the clocking that it came out with. it's one or the other...
looking at your pic, I hope that's not regular grade braided stainless hose? especially on the high-pressure side. needs to be rated for up to 1200 psi, and also formulated for power steering fluid, which will degrade and seep through regular automotive rubber hose (e.g. fuel, water, oil rated). I went with the Earls braided steel teflon lined for my HP side, although the Earls PS-specific hose has a higher pressure rating. and with the regular old PS return hose from the the gearbox to the reservoir. I tried to use the Earls blue PS-specific hose for the return line, but couldn't get it to fit over the hose nipple on the steel pipe on the PS pump reservoir. very frustrating. so had to go with regular automotive grade, but still PS fluid specific.
regardless, glad you got it all bolted together and hooked up. I was reluctant to file a flat on my factory column end, so had to work with the clocking that it came out with. it's one or the other...
Yes I have high pressure ptfe hose on the high pressure side. and regular braide hose on the low side. thanks
03-11-2016, 10:40 AM
