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Old 11-01-2012, 02:30 PM   #1
Tom454
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Default 1970 Shifter Question

I have a 1970 LS5 (454) with a Hurst shifter on it. The shifter handle hits the console and rips up the leather shifter boot. It also doesn't shift right anymore and the trans hangs up. So... I'm replacing it with a new OEM type shifter. I don't need the Hurst.... I don't race anymore. Question... many vendors seem to have the OEM style shifter and linkage kits... but not all have the "GM Restoration Part" logo. Is there any difference just because it has the logo in the catalog? The difference in price seems to be small. I'm concerned with quality. I don't want to be the guinea pig or do this twice.

"This logo indicates that the product is no longer available from General Motors, but is manufactured to GM's specifications and licensed by GM as an official GM Restoration Part. Such products represent a prestigious class of restoration parts that are nearly identical to the products offered by GM, and are made from the original GM tooling whenever possible"


Blah Blah Blah.... but is there really a difference?

Last edited by Tom454; 11-01-2012 at 03:14 PM.
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Old 11-01-2012, 03:33 PM   #2
Easy Mike
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Given the choice, I would go with the Restoration Part. Just my .02.

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Old 11-02-2012, 07:43 AM   #3
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Given the choice, I would go with the Restoration Part. Just my .02.

That's what I'm thinking too. I emailed the (cheaper) vendor without the logo and asked if theirs is a GM authorized repro. If no, I'm going with the other (GM logo) vendor.
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Old 11-02-2012, 08:21 AM   #4
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Have you considered rebuilding your current shifter? Are you using the 'short throw' linkage position?
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Old 11-02-2012, 12:52 PM   #5
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Have you considered rebuilding your current shifter? Are you using the 'short throw' linkage position?
Current shifter is a Hurst Competition... was on the car when I bought it. It was acting up, so as part of a clutch job, I tore it down, cleaned it, and lubed it. It was full of road grit. I didn't change any adjustments. It's still takes a lot of muscle to shift .... wife can't drive it very well. It has always hit the console in 1st and 3rd gears from day one... the shifter boot was all tore up when I bought the car. I could not find any documentation on how to set it up. So I don't know what you mean by "short throw" linkage position. I also replaced the shifter boot and it is already getting hammered. It's time to get rid of the Hurst. I bought the car around 1986... so the shifter has some miles on it... used the car as a daily driver several times for extended periods. I have the GM Original Factory shifter in my 66 and I like it just fine.

Do you know where I can find documentation on how to set it up and adjust it? I looked pretty extensively... no luck.

At this point, it's going to cost me about $310 for a new shifter and a used mounting bracket. +S&H.

Last edited by Tom454; 02-08-2013 at 10:31 AM.
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Old 11-02-2012, 01:39 PM   #6
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If I were replacing a worn out Hurst Shifter, I would buy another Hurst. Of course that is just my opinion. You could have the shifter arms drilled lower to have a "short throw" position. That would take care of the shifter hitting the console. If you like the stock "look", you can buy a stock appearing handle for the Hurst Shifter.
After replacing my stock shifter with a Hurst Shifter, I would have a hard time going back to a stock shifter. Again, just my opinion.
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Old 11-02-2012, 01:49 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Big Block 69 View Post
If I were replacing a worn out Hurst Shifter, I would buy another Hurst. Of course that is just my opinion. You could have the shifter arms drilled lower to have a "short throw" position. That would take care of the shifter hitting the console. If you like the stock "look", you can buy a stock appearing handle for the Hurst Shifter.
After replacing my stock shifter with a Hurst Shifter, I would have a hard time going back to a stock shifter. Again, just my opinion.

Going to the OEM shifter is a step down.
To each his own but there is NO WAY I'd drop over 300 bucks just to go back to the craptastic OEM shifter.
If your Hurst shifter is (was) a Competition Plus, there is no way it should be hitting anything on the console if it was installed and adjusted properly.
Just my 2 cents
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Old 11-02-2012, 01:59 PM   #8
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Long makes a good shifter, pricey but well worth it...

Last edited by GDaina; 11-02-2012 at 02:01 PM.
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Old 11-02-2012, 03:09 PM   #9
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If you stay with the Hurst, I highly recommend you perform THIS MODIFICATION. It's for a 67-69 Camaro, but it also works on the Corvette.

Ed
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Old 11-02-2012, 03:45 PM   #10
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Don't give up on the Hurst prematurely. A properly setup Comp Plus shifter in good repair is going to be much better than even a brand new OEM shifter. One reason is that the Hurst mounts directly to the transmission, eliminating driveline movement from the linkage equation. My $.02, you're welcome.
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Old 11-02-2012, 04:36 PM   #11
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tom454, I have a brand new Hurst CP shifter with a stock looking T handle. I bought it earlier this year and installed it when I replaced my clutch. Personally, I did not like it and went back to the 43 year old stock shifter. The throws were way too long and the handle hit the console trying to go into reverse. The car never got off jack stands before I reinstalled the stock shifter. pm if you're interested in it.
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Old 11-03-2012, 08:33 AM   #12
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Thanks for all the info & responses. My wife cannot get the trans into reverse... it takes too much force to overcome the Hurst reverse "lockout". Plus... as noted by other members... hitting the console appears to be an issue at times. Drilling the links for a shorter throw would just make it harder to shift for my wife... so that is out. This Hurst may not be installed or set up properly... I did not install it. But- I cannot find any documentation for adjustment/setup.... so it has to go. Unless somebody can send me the docs I have to go with a new stock unit. My wife can shift the stock shifter in my C2 no problem.

I just rebuilt a Q-Jet for my cousins boat in San Diego and I need this car as a test mule to set up the carb... he has been waiting over a year for his carb... so I have to move on this shifter problem.

If anybody knows where I can get documentation on re-setting up the Hurst... I would appreciate it. Othwerwise it's history.

Thanks again for the responses so far.
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Old 11-03-2012, 08:46 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by restoman1 View Post
If you stay with the Hurst, I highly recommend you perform THIS MODIFICATION. It's for a 67-69 Camaro, but it also works on the Corvette.

Ed
Thanks for the link... very informative. Looks like the only adjustments are the two stops and the neutral alignment hole. I did not change the stops when I cleaned it for fear of throwing the gear engagements off. Without detailed original setup instructions, it was better left as-is. And- I did use the neutral alignment hole. So I guess the problem is inherent with the Hurst shifter. Wow!.... did you see that chewed up console in that pic? Pretty bad. Now I know that I'm not alone.

Doing that mod will make it harder to shift for my wife... shorter levers means less "leverage"... so... no can do.

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Old 11-03-2012, 09:06 AM   #14
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Here are the copies of the instructions I have. Hope you can read them. If not, pm me and I'll email them to you. FWIW, many years ago when I changed the trans fluid, I used 75-90 gear oil. It took a lot of effort to shift it until the gear oil got warm. Drained it out and filled it with Mobil 1 synthetic gear oil. Shifts smooth as can be.

http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...B/IMG_0002.jpg
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...B/IMG_0001.jpg
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/bb105/07TB/IMG.jpg
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Old 11-03-2012, 10:21 AM   #15
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I would drill the arms for short throw to avoid hitting the console. You are right, this will add resistance since you are losing leverage. You might try a longer stick. Since this is a bolt on stick, I used a Mopar Hurst Pistol Grip stick from a 71 Road Runner. There are several different lengths of Pistol Grips, But they may not be what you like. Hurst makes SEVERAL different length sticks, all shapes and sizes that will bolt to your shifter. A longer stick will help overcome the reverse gate spring.
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Old 11-03-2012, 10:32 AM   #16
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I don't think moving the rods to the lower hole will have any effect on left to right movement of the shifter handle. It changes the distance the shifter handle moves fore and aft. Tom, before letting the car off of the jackstands,I'd use the short throw holes and see if the wife has any troubles with it that way. My GF has no problems, but is scared of the power of the 427, so she drives the GN. Even using my Hurst in the short throw holes, the distance was way too much for my liking, not counting hitting the console trying to go into reverse. I went back to the original 69 shifter.
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Old 11-03-2012, 11:07 AM   #17
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Tom et al, the short throw modification I posted doesn't make shifting any harder than what it normally is. The fore/aft throw is shortened, but as 3X2 stated, it doesn't do anything for the left to right movement. That's not controllable since it's set in the shifter itself.

My 68 Camaro has a Hurst Competition Plus in it and shifting into reverse is not that difficult. The detent is very soft. My 69 Corvette also has a Hurst Competition Plus in it and shifting into reverse it VERY difficult. The detent is really heavy. Not sure why the two are different since they're the same basic shifter but you're right, it's hard to get it past the "stop".

However, a year of so ago, my Camaro shifter was loose and sloppy, and it would engage two gears at once, locking things up on me. I would have to find a hill to park on that would allow me to crawl up under the car and put the arms back to "normal" before I could continue on.

I purchased a rebuild kit from INLINETUBE (P/N INL10199 - bottom left) for $22.00 plus shipping and rebuilt it. Now it shifts like butter and it's even EASIER to put into reverse! Probably because of the new grease and everything's clean. I haven't done the Vette yet, but when I pull the transmission to change the clutch, I plan on doing it. Not sure when that will be, so don't wait for me to get back to you.

It's not hard to rebuild this shifter and there are a few sites that give good instructions. HERE'S one from Yenko.net, and HERE'S another from one of those "other guys" forums. (same basic shifter)

Just be VERY careful when handling the plates because they're da@& sharp and will cut you to ribbons. (Don't ask me how I know!!)

Anyway, good luck on your project and let us know how things turn out either way.

Ed

Last edited by restoman1; 11-03-2012 at 11:09 AM.
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Old 11-04-2012, 08:47 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3X2 View Post
Here are the copies of the instructions I have. Hope you can read them. If not, pm me and I'll email them to you. FWIW, many years ago when I changed the trans fluid, I used 75-90 gear oil. It took a lot of effort to shift it until the gear oil got warm. Drained it out and filled it with Mobil 1 synthetic gear oil. Shifts smooth as can be.

http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...B/IMG_0002.jpg
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...B/IMG_0001.jpg
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/bb105/07TB/IMG.jpg
Thanks! I have an extra Muncie sitting in the corner and can play with the shifter on the bench to see what gives.
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Old 11-04-2012, 08:49 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by 3X2 View Post
I don't think moving the rods to the lower hole will have any effect on left to right movement of the shifter handle. It changes the distance the shifter handle moves fore and aft. Tom, before letting the car off of the jackstands,I'd use the short throw holes and see if the wife has any troubles with it that way. My GF has no problems, but is scared of the power of the 427, so she drives the GN. Even using my Hurst in the short throw holes, the distance was way too much for my liking, not counting hitting the console trying to go into reverse. I went back to the original 69 shifter.
There aren't any short throw holes... I would have to drill them per the Camaro link above.
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Old 11-04-2012, 08:51 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by restoman1 View Post
Tom et al, the short throw modification I posted doesn't make shifting any harder than what it normally is. The fore/aft throw is shortened, but as 3X2 stated, it doesn't do anything for the left to right movement. That's not controllable since it's set in the shifter itself.

My 68 Camaro has a Hurst Competition Plus in it and shifting into reverse is not that difficult. The detent is very soft. My 69 Corvette also has a Hurst Competition Plus in it and shifting into reverse it VERY difficult. The detent is really heavy. Not sure why the two are different since they're the same basic shifter but you're right, it's hard to get it past the "stop".

However, a year of so ago, my Camaro shifter was loose and sloppy, and it would engage two gears at once, locking things up on me. I would have to find a hill to park on that would allow me to crawl up under the car and put the arms back to "normal" before I could continue on.

I purchased a rebuild kit from INLINETUBE (P/N INL10199 - bottom left) for $22.00 plus shipping and rebuilt it. Now it shifts like butter and it's even EASIER to put into reverse! Probably because of the new grease and everything's clean. I haven't done the Vette yet, but when I pull the transmission to change the clutch, I plan on doing it. Not sure when that will be, so don't wait for me to get back to you.

It's not hard to rebuild this shifter and there are a few sites that give good instructions. HERE'S one from Yenko.net, and HERE'S another from one of those "other guys" forums. (same basic shifter)

Just be VERY careful when handling the plates because they're da@& sharp and will cut you to ribbons. (Don't ask me how I know!!)

Anyway, good luck on your project and let us know how things turn out either way.

Ed
Thanks... I'll look into the kits. A new Hurst is big $$$. I don't want to throw it away just yet. I'm going to order a new factory shifter etc first just to get the car moving again.
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