pingdashf

I sure know what you mean about lack of work ethic. I have none. Never have liked working, and wouldn't if I could find an alternate way to pay the bills that is still halfway respectable. I know I NEED a work ethic, but as long as people pay me for half-butt work, why bust my butt for the same coin?
Maybe I'll grow out of it someday?

Wanting74

There are some people out there that actually have a work ethic. It just few and far between anymore. I love to bust my butt on a project to get it completed on time and with a better than expected final result. The problem I have been facing is that managers would rather hire somebody that has that extra year of experience opposed to somebody who's more than willing to pull 60+ hr. work weeks to get the job done and done right. Having graduated college two years ago I've only been able to pick up small contracing jobs here and there. Of the hundreds of jobs I've applied for, the few and far between interviews I've been on, it's always come back the same, we hired somebody with more experience... this includes good jobs at CISCO and NC State U., to crappy retail jobs in the mall.

On a similar note, it just kills me to look at the consulting firm my wife works for. The number of people there that are slackers, don't know their stuff, and waste resources like there is no tomorrow is insane. Fire ten of them, hire me and get twice the amout of work. Too bad managemnt can't see past their brown noses.

OK, I'll get off the soap box now.


[Modified by Wanting74, 1:17 AM 5/4/2002]

theandies

Paul79 - Is this one of the guys you fired? This is the attitude that is rampant in today’s teenagers and early 20's people. My dad always said "The world need ditch diggers too" and with this attitude I guess we have another ditch digger here. I was brought up by a very hard working father (he still works 6 days a week at the age of 72 not because he has to but because he want to) and he instilled this work ethic in me at a young age. Do your best work even if it is just cutting the grass or washing the dishes. The problem now days are a lack of respect and discipline. Grow up or it’s going to be a long life at the end of a shovel. I hope you do grow out of this attitude.
John

mrvette

IF you really want to know WHY the work ethic stinks, look at management,....
in about 80% of the cases in private industry, as soon as any non union employett stays around untill 20-25 years, giving the best of his working life, what passes for modern 'management' fires his butt.....out on the street, and strange thing, it's allways just before he gets vested in his retirement programme....and don't say it doesn't happen, because it's happening countless times all over the country, so much so that it's considered 'normal'.....
classic case in point is an old friend of mine since High School daze, I"m age 58 BTW....well Ken went to work for a beer company some 30 years ago, just out of the navy....and joined the Teamsters Union....smart move, he is the ONLY person I know of in private industry that has had ANY job stability ANY, and all those fellow union guys that took 'management' jobs and gave up their union membership have been fired and layed off over the years...Ken just stayed in his union job....and he put both his daughters through CPA school,...not too bad for a working stiff....now that his health is failing the union has enough clout to keep his job a float....NOW, there are only 4 types of jobs worth having in this country, 5 if you can find a union job....
Medical, CPA, Lawyer, Govt. worker....that's it, there are NO other jobs worth a damn, fired, riffed, layed off, seasonal, really lousey working conditions, like in a shipyard in winter/summer get older the see what happens, sh it that you toss off as a kid starts getting to you after age 35 or so, if not sooner....and guess what??? todays kids know that sh it uation damn well, as they hear stories of their friend's dads/moms...hear their parents complain about just that.....so what's the use of dedication.....and guess what??? I think the kid's right, don't do much for his 'career' and job rating, but then again anyone that escapes that employment life cycle is lucky...very lucky....
and that luck has little to do with skill or dedication, just picking the right employer....that's it....
I tell both my teenage kids, Laura and Tom....the above, exactly my speech....and I say that to any kid, they might as well know going in that what passes for modern management could care less about them other than a hello in the morning, and I been at ton's of jobs where not even that was done....

NOPE, sorry, private industry sux as an employer, period....

GENE

Fevre

Paul

I think you actual did them a favor by firing them. If they don't learn repect for authority then they will have no repect at all. Too often these days young people are coddled and don't realize there are consequences to their action. I have to admit I did not have the greatest work ethic but after losing a job or two and not liking my standard of living I decided i had to do something about it. I finished college, worked two jobs (and still do sorta) and now am feel like a man instead of a spoiled brat. Hopefully you explained to them why you fired them and tried to impart some of your wisdon upon them. Even though they may not appreciate it now they may look back and realize the error of their ways. Hopefully.

Good luck in your search, there are good kids out there and you will find some. Try hiring some girls, I've seen enough of them support their deadbeat boyfriends/husbands and you can mold them into vette chicks. :)

Chris

jsimpson

Teamsters Unions may have clout but Teachers Unions, at least it the South, are paper tigers, usually in collusion with management. When I had a stroke in 96 and damage to my brain prevented me from being able to any longer deal with a bunch of people at the same time, I went to my union for help because my principal had started moving me out of my quasi-administrative jobs and my technology job and back into the classroom. I was doing a great job in the administrative and tech duties, but according to the school board's own doctors, could not at all handle classroom control and discipline. So what does my principal do, move me out of what I can do and into what I can't do! The union wrote a letter, the school board denied the union's request for accomodation, and the union let it go at that! After anoter four years of appealing through cannels and trying to do my job with the help of massive ammounts of prescription drugs, I had a stress breakdown. I retired on disability. I sued, and a federal judge decided without a trial that I was not disabled and therefore ruled for the school board. He made that decision without meeting or talking to me, and in spite of the fact tat Social Security, Florida Retirement System, and te School Board's Disability Insurance Company all had determined that I am 100 % disabled! Guess what guys, if workers have a bad attitude, you don't have to look too hard to find the reason!!!

MassVette

Many groups can claim "victory" for what you are witnessing-
Lazy, selfish, immature parents that pursue materialism on a treadmill;
Schools that are more worried about 'sensitivity' and 'self-esteem' than values and education;
governments that remove personal responsibility (give you 'something for nothing') in exchange for your vote;
churches that tell their adherents 'it's OK to do or be anything'............
the list goes on and on.
BTW, when's the last time someone from the "lazy-****" generation said "thank you" to you at a cash register? You get "There you go" (whatever that means), or "Have a nice day", while we look at their sarcastic glare.
In my opinion, the present generation thinks that times were ALWAYS this affluent and easy. I think this is really the root of all their problems, and their "don't give a snott" attitude.
:mad :smash: :smash: :smash: :mad


[Modified by MassVette, 10:38 AM 5/4/2002]

Paul L

Thanks to all who replied. Very worthwhile reading and cross-section of opinions. That is one of the reasons I frequent the Forum. And thanks to the moderators for not taking this to Off Topic; a place that I abhor.

I particularly wish to thank pingdashf for his/her candid views. I do not know if he/she was simply being facetious. But if not, that blunt honesty was refreshing. I certainly do not agree with what was said but c'est la vie. The right to express an opnion is something that we all take for granted but it is a precious element of our North American society.

Fevre. When I first arrived on the job there was a young woman (19 or so) who worked a morning shift. She loved the grease and oil and could spin off an oil filter with the best of them. Wonderful personality, energetic and work-work-work. This intrigued me. Turns out she is a co-op student from a local community college: works in the morning and studies in the afternoon. Does not know what she wishes to do in life so she thought she would give automotive repair a try. Comes from a family including five brothers who tinker with cars so perhaps that is the origin of this idea.

I was assigned as her co-op supervisor and two weeks ago did a performance appraisal with her, her academic supervisor and the shop foreman. Based on that appraisal she has now moved on to brake work and motor repair. I dwelled on the negative yesterday perhaps a little too heavily. There are many such positive stories out there. My sense is that she has the basic traits to make a success of herself whatever career path(s) she eventually chooses.

Thanks again for all the replies. Time now to drive; the %$#@ snow has gone away:) .

noskillz

I agree to mrvette to a degree. I am respectful and work very hard, but I do it for my own pride (thought I do work for someone). The reality of today is that business owners dont stick with their employees, they stick with the shareholders. I'm fine with that, they own the company, but first job that I see that pays enough, I'm gone. Same treatment they would give me, so no hard feelings.

When we talk about how it was when we were young, business was VERY different then. I seemed to be more of a TEAM effort (even though it really wasn't - owners got rich - u got paid, but it was a living). That's not the case today. All our work ethic got us in the end was long workdays and some other a##hole rich.

I am not bitter, but I am no fool. I constantly keep feelers out, plan my own retirement, and keep myself trained - no employer is going to look out for you, it's your responsibility. I put a good day, do my best work, do what I can to promote the company but, when it comes time to go home the I GO HOME.

Lately we have seen the emergence of the "balanced lifestyle". This is a good thing. Back in our early days people identified themselves with their career. I am glad to see this turning around. IF you make enough to keep food on the table then forget the politics, long nights and weekends, and the business trips - go home and play with your kids.

ddecart

:rolleyes:

Lets look at a simple example. You tell me which one you think is more likely:

A) You show up to work, late maybe, you goof off, slack off, and in general you act unprofessionally and you show a lack of good work ethics.

In response, the boss thinks "You know, if I just pay him a more and give him a better job, he'll be a GREAT worker!"

or....

B) You show up to work on time, you act in a very professional manner and you work had, regardless of the job you're doing or how much you're getting paid.

The boss thinks, "WOW! I'm impressed. Here's a dedicated, hard worker. He's probably capable of more than he's doing now. I'll give him a raise and a promotion."

Hmmm.....so which one do you think is more likely?

KorbenDallas

I started working when I was 15, a bag-boy at the local Winn-Dixie. I looked like I was 10yrs old and was treated like an afterthought at work. My managers didn't keep track of the work I was doing, and the bag-boys that have been there for a while were smart enough to see this. They pawned off their work on me and I had no choice but to do it. Why did I put up with this? I had something to prove. I didn't care if they were twice my size and older than me: I was going to prove to them that I could do it.

Eventually the hard work paid off and the cash office was looking to hire some cashier's to run their registers about a year and a half later. There was only ONE male cashier and he had a slipped disc in his back from sports. The head cashier wanted to train me since she knew my work ethic, but the managers did NOT want to train me because they didn't want to lose me as a bag-boy!!!!! NO kidding, they respected me that much. (The hard work paid off!)

I was trained as a cashier, then my hard work there got me trained to be in the cash office, and then the managers were wanting to promote me to manager while the head cashier wanted me to be her assistant. But I concentrated on my studies and now (a few years later) I have a computer job. It's alot less stress & BS, but I'm working my butt off like I always have.

So working hard DOES pay off, and I have a Corvette to prove it. I am sure that's the reason for lack of work ethic today. "Why should I work hard when I'm having everything handed to me?"

Honestly, I've had everything handed to me when I was growing up. But I was raised with my father constantly telling me, "You're not always going to have everything handed to you son. I've had to work hard for the things that I'm providing you and you will have to do the same when you get older." My father gave me guidance with my first job, and basically he instilled my work ethic in me. I can remember my mother saying, "Why don't you work as hard at home as you do at work?" Obviously that's because I was given everything I needed at home regardless if I worked hard there or not.

Hopefully this has given another perspective about working habits of "the younger generation". I think this is the first time that I've ever given my age on the forum, because in my opinion age shouldn't matter. But I'm 24 years old and I am thankful how easy my parents made it for me growing up. I am also thankful for the hard work ethic my father instilled in me. Yes, you can do half of the work and get paid the same amount of money. But you will always do half the work and make the same amount of money! You don't get promoted by showing up and going just enough to get by, you get promoted by showing hard work ethic and initiative.

Luckily, I work in a department where my coworkers have the same work ethic as me. This is good since we pull our own weight, but it makes it even harder for me to stand out!!! Now I'm going to work full-time, college part time, and studying new things on top of that. I'm trying to prove myself not only to the agency I work for, but to my family as well (my family dosn't have much college). So far both places seem to be intimidated by little-ol' me!

Hope this gives you hope about the "younger generation" paul79. Good luck with your interviews. :seeya


[Modified by FroDaddy, 10:52 AM 5/4/2002]

ZORA_RULES

I concur completly. I am only 29...but I was raised as a country boy by a blue collar dad. We built our own house and I worked on it constantly from the time I was in 7th grade and we finished when I was a Sr in HS. It was hard work and I never got to go out much and do typical teenage stuff as I was helping out Dad (btw I hate doing any of that stuff now..he broke me :) ). My parent weren't rich and I went off to college and worked a UPS night shift and a Frito Lay weekend route on top of college full loads in accounting. I use to get extremly aggrevated because my grades weren't up to par, but between working and trying to have some college fun it made it tough. I got through though and exceled at my job at UPS and was a Supervisor relatively quickly.

The good part..even though I had a tough time landing my first real job in my profession (Started at Kelsey Hayes Axle...who made the special Alum. wheels for the vette from 76-82) due to my grades. I'd interview against kids that hadn't had to work and came out of college with high GPAs. But the good point was..I was use to working in production environments....and could work circles around most of those that had been realtively sheltered and never really known manual labor. It paid off in several promotions and job changes and I'm very happy at my current job. But I notice people all the time, relatively close to my own age that are just flat lazy. This isn't everyone obviosly...but some people just expect to get everything handed to them..and then act like you're "lucky" if you're doing well. Obviously you need some breaks....but I'm glad my dad and coaches were tough on me growing up...and let me learn the value of a $ at a young age. I can't imagine going through life the other way. Off my soap box now...just my $02. But I do feel this is a lot of the reason I usually relate to people that are 10-20 yrs older than me....than people my own age at times. Work ethics are indeed different today on the whole (again not everyone...still lots of people have to tough it out)

MIKER

Paul,
You are correct, their attitude stinks and there is no good excuse for it. To answer the question "WHY" would be tough to do. Their replacements will likely have about the same attitude, only the faces will change. So instead of hoping for a miracle employee to show up, you may have to create/mold the desired employee. You are the Supervisor, the mentor. Compliment them when they do a good job and patiently teach them when they screw up. Encourage them to be successful in life. Hopefully they will not be lube monkeys for ever.
With a lot of hard work and a little luck, you may turn out to be one of the people that they remember as having had a positive affect on their life.
This just an opinion. I am not saying that I could do what I have suggested but great leaders always earn respect.
Good luck and keep us posted.

slaine

Hi Guys! I own a small business. It's NOT much but it's all mine. We have one and only one motto, " 'Good enough' is not good enough". I am not a hard worker in the physical sense. My employees are. I put caring, pride and lots of thought into everything I do. That seems to make up for my not being particularly smart or hard working.
This thread is true and depressing. I gave up a long time ago on letting anyone work on my house or my cars ( I left a Mercury Cyclone at a filling station for an oil change, when I came back early, they were doing burn-outs with it).
Now when I deal with people while dining out, my doctor, my dentist or the (sigh) guys behind the parts counter, when they do something well, I quietly and HUMBLY point it out, let them know that I appreciate it and that they're on the right path. If management is available, I let them know. I don't make a big deal about it in hopes that the employee will figure it out and make this good moment something of their own and want to repeat again.
It's a small amount of lubricant in a world that desperately needs more. Before I get off my soapbox, "Woe betide anyone that is careless and lazy and tries to charge me money for it."
Mike
ps Paul79, I would trust YOU to change the oil in my vette :)

Chris Fowler

There is always the other side to this...

The last company I worked for (programmer):

- I had no idea what a 40 hour week was. If I was there less than 50 hours it felt odd. 80+ hour weeks were not uncommon. This was mostly to make up for the work that other people were not able to complete.

- I was employee #1. It was a startup and I was hired by one of the founders right after she started the company. I had worked for her as an intern at IBM up to the point she started her own company. She thought enough of me to base the companies first products on my work alone.

- I was there 5 1/2 years and then laid off last year.

I gave everything I had to that company for 5 1/2 years and they showed no dedication to me.

Frustrating...

Especially seeing people who's work I had to make up for lasting longer at the company than I did...

daniel77350

I am 18 and I really have to agree. I never noticed how slack the work force was until I started working. I currently have 2 jobs, and at both of them, I am an "important employee" and I've only been there for a month. At one job, the boss was simply amazed that I could do decimal to fraction conversions in my head. In fact she gave me a raise for that. :jester

When I work, I do work hard(I think anyway), and when I see people standing around and going slow I wonder how they can do it.

But from another perspective, for me, because I work hard, I get taken advantage of often. I do multiple jobs because "I know what Im doing". so people ask for help, and I oblige just because Im tired of seeing the task take so long. If I could help it, I'd be slack too, just so people would ask me to do their jobs too. But I can't help but work constantly...if Im not at work though, I don't want to do anything...

Daniel

Paul L

Slaine,
Thanks for the supreme compliment! I trust few people to touch my Corvette....

Paul L

I have been thinking about this thread and its various replies. Particularly those from the under-25 folks. On reflection, the title and my text imply that an entire generation of young people lacks the work ethic. That really was not my intention. Many, many young people work very hard and like all generations, there are those who do not. I suppose I should have said that for a number of societal and workforce reasons, the work ethic in general has been diminishing for some time. And some respondents have touched on possible reasons for that. It has been educational to be put in my place by the younger set. Thanks for setting me straight!

8T1-7T9 BIONIC VETTE

paul79,
When I started here as the General Manager, all the employees were hostile and made every effort to have me fired...They were stealing, not doing their jobs, lots of smoke breaks, etc....After three months of trying to work with these guys.....I fired all of them and replaced them with a handfull of quality workers....Now the place is run smoothly and I continue to receive compliments on my management style....Here's what I do....I eat out a lot and use many different types of commercial establishments....I watch for employees who go the extra effort to provide good quality customer service....I approach that employee and give him/her my business card and tell him/her if they ever need another job please keep me in mind....I've picked up some fine individuals in this manner...I also have good luck with US Marines, many still have good morals and values and can be trusted to get any job assigned to them completed in a timely manner. Their loyalty is above reproach. Good Luck and hang in there....there are good people out there.....you just have to sift through a lot of weeds to find quality :seeya Cappy

Juliet

I think the parents have a lot of influence (even amidst the 60's rebellion generation). If the parents have a good work ethic and good attitudes it naturally rubs off on the kids. When you have parents who are slackers, do nothing extra, complain about their jobs and are fiscally irresponsible then the kids are more likely to follow in their footsteps. Personally I doubt there are many of the younger shark owners who will fit into that category because it takes a certain amount of dedication to keep a shark on the road. Plus you're not going to find easy financing for one - you'll need to "save your pennies" first - for the most part. There is the other end of the extreme though - the work -a -holic who puts the company before everything else. I often wonder if kids of parents who are so wrapped up in their careers are more likely to just blow it all off and goof off just to try to balance things out. :yesnod: