demoke

Need some advise. I have a 1980 4/speed that i had an engine rebuild on in april. This is what I had done: 9.5 to 1 Speed Pro Hypereutectic Pistons, a Comp Cams .500 lift Hydraulic Roller Camshaft, Professional Products Typhoon Intake and a 750 CFM Holley Carb. The problem is, I am having an issue with oil consumption. I have taken the car back to the mechanic-- no leaks anywhere but I am going through about 1 quart every 2-300 miles. I use my car as a daily driver but only drive about 10 miles per day. I did take a 500 mile trip recently and had to put oil every 250 miles. The car doesn't seem to smoke when i drive, just when it is warming up. My question is: my mechanic says my rings did not seal properly. The engine rebuild is under a 1 year warranty. He said he needs to remove the engine, which he sub-contracts out, and he will seal the rings properly-no charge to me. However, he says I must pay the $600.00 fee to have the engine removed and put back in. Is this something that he should cover under warranty? Please advise...Thanks for your help, Robert

...Roger...

Have you tried a ring breakin procedure ?

demoke

can u explain a ring breakin procedure...?

Project80

Did he say why he didn't seal the rings properly the first time?

woodlandcorvette

Based on a normal shop rate of 60 dollars a hour it seems a bit excessive for 10 hrs to remove and install a motor in these cars sound like hes wanting to recoup his time also my guess would be 5 hrs max or half that amount if its his wrong doing what good is a year warrenty for if its 600 everytime that idiot dont do something right. How much did he charge for the rebuild and install when he did it that would give us a better idea if he overchanged for that also. I feal he shouldnt charge you anything and should make it right. Good luck on all that, glad I do all my own work so many just rip people off.

wnmech

Read your warranty paperwork to see what it mentions as far as who pays for what. Like project80 says ask him why he did not seal the rings right the first time? It sounds like he screwed up the rebuild and is trying to recoup part of his money back. You should pay nothing in my opinion

BobC9

QUOTE=wnmech;1571291729]Read your warranty paperwork to see what it mentions as far as who pays for what. Like project80 says ask him why he did not seal the rings right the first time? It sounds like he screwed up the rebuild and is trying to recoup part of his money back. You should pay nothing in my opinion[/QUOTE]
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The written warranty should spell out what is covered. IMHO the fact that he contracts out the engine work shouldn't matter. If he wants to recoup some of his money, he should get it from the engine shop.

MotorHead

I would bite the bullet and pay with the written guarantee it stops using oil or it comes out again on his dime.

Most of these guys would tell you it's your fault and get lost, at least this guy is willing to work with you to some degree. I would be pretty mad myself but this is the way it is sometimes with cars. $5-600 is the going rate around here for a re an re of a motor so I don't think that's too far off

Project80

Finding out why the rings didn't seal would be a priority for me and also I would want to know how he plans on fixing the situation. I'm thinking at least honing & new rings! I've never been in this situation, maybe somebody could jump in with what's required to make it right.

I have to agree with MotorHead, since the guy is willing to work with you, I would probably pay to pull out the motor.

Grumpy 427

Pull the motor yourself, and toss it through his living room window. Well maybe just pull the motor and get him to fix it on his dime now. Obviously he screwed up along the way?

7T1vette

Well... if he is honest, he is offering a way to solve a problem. If he's not, he knows how to fix your problem without removing the engine and will do so for an additional $600! Piston rings that have not sealed do not have blowby at start-up only. They will have blowby all the time. Either there is a valve seal [or seals] that are damaged or the oil may be getting ingested by way of the PCV valve or valve cover baffles...or it could be something else. But, I would call around to a Corvette club [or two] and find who is a trusted engine guy/gal for them. Then have it looked at to get a 'second opinion'. If you get the 'unsealed rings' diagnosis again, consider your mechanic's suggestion. But make certain you read all the fine-print in your engine warranty to understand what your coverages are and what your responsibilities are in any circumstance.

moosie982

Possible mismatch of the intake gaskets ?
Peace,,, Moosie

Easy Mike

From what I read, he's already paid once. Looks to me like it might be time to pay an attorney.

...Roger...

Let me get this straight, your mechanic is the engine builder but he does not pull engines ?
How did you pay for this ? One check to the engine builder and one check to the engine puller ?
Or just one check to your mechanic for the engine pulling and engine building ?

billla

I'd offer that a little troubleshooting is in order before we draw cause-and-effect between high oil consumption and poor ring seal. Doing compression and leak-down tests, followed by pulling a head seems to make a lot more sense than yanking the engine - regardless of who pays for it. 7T1Vette has it right from my experience - I'd suspect the oil is going elsewhere and the leak-down and a good set of ears will tell you that.

If the rings "did not seal properly" that's a much bigger issue than it seems on the surface. Modern rings seal almost instantly (although I've taken heat for this comment on another thread ) and if they didn't either they're they're lousy rings ("rebuilder" quality iron rings) or the bore wasn't properly prepared. Regardless, it raises some red flags for me. Were there break-in proceedures provided, and if so - did you follow them?

The R&R price seems high to me as well, but no engine warranty includes R&R as part of the deal. But if he needs to take the engine out to fix his poor workmanship, he should at least be splitting the cost with you IMHO.

Sounds like a nice build and I'm sure you'll get it squared away. Just be sure that you get clear documentation on the next steps.

Lee H

Have to agree with Billla, Leak down and then pull the heads. Surprised the mechanic went directly to pull the motor. Combo leak down and compression test will more than likely tell if the leak is at the rings, gaskets, or valves. Also agree that new tech rings seal in the first few miles so if leak down points to rings they used cheap old style rings or did not prep the cylinders right. I would ask the mechanic if he test drove the car before giving it to you. Most of those guys break in the rings on the test drive and shake down.

billla

As an aside, a leak-down isn't a super hard test to do and the tools are cheap. Having someone that's done it before is a help - but that's what boards like this are for as was noted by a poster on this thread

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=94190

Jack Wood

With a proper rebuild, the rings don't have any choice but to seal. You paid for something and didn't get what you paid for. Your first sign should have been he didn't pull the motor. Tell him to do it right, do it for free or you're taking him to (small claims) court. And have a lawyer buddy send him a letter just to rattle his cage then you can do small claims court without a lawyer. Have a third party document the compression tests, etc. for evidence. He has no defense. Get your money back and find a real tech - don't let him near it again. Q: What's the difference in a mechanic and a technician? A: about $30,000 per year.

demoke

Thx for all the replies...we have agreed that he is going to do two major tests to see if there is anything wrong with the engine, a leak test and a compression test.
I am taking it to him next week...I did say I cannot/will not pay an additional $600.00.

I'll keep you all posted...Thx Robert

billla

Good luck, Robert. We know something is wrong given the oil usage - it's just a question of what.

I don't know that I'd characterize these as "major" tests - both of them should be done in an hour or so. I'd suggest you read up on both so you fully understand what's happening and the detailed results he's going to provide.

I'm putting a crisp $20 on valve seals/guides. Loser donates to their local Ronald McDonald house. Any takers in the pool?