DIP51

I have a zz454 crate motor in my '71 and was considering fuel injetion options. I had discussed with some members the Ram Jet option, but it won't clear the L-88 hood. I could extend the scoop, but I like the way it looks as is.

I was wondering if anyone had any experience with a FI unit off a truck engine. Like the Ram Jet it's a multi-port unit and the overall height is only 9 1/2 inches. I have not checked the height of the intake/carb/air cleaner under there now, but I would think it should fit.

Will I be able to program this thing to perform like I want it to, or will it act like the truck it came off?? Any info would be appreciated. If anyone has used this setup before, I'm all ears.

SteveG75

Here you go:
http://www.corvetteforum.net/c3/zwed.../efi/efi_1.htm
Zwede has a 454 with a Holley Commander 950 fuel injection system and L-88 hood.

DIP51

Thanks Steve,

I saw that thread when I did a search, but I was wondering about the Vortech system in particular. I can grab one for cheap $$$ but didn't know if it would make the power I was looking for. If it's gonna run like a truck...they can keep it!!!

I'm Batman

GM used a TBI system on some 454s.

DIP51

No this unit has plenums and a MAF sensor, not a throttle body.

shafrs3

The truck intake might fit, it won't fit under the stock BB hood. I picked up one off of eBay to see if it would fit under my stock hood, I think it was a half inch too tall.

L88Plus

The path for airflow thru 'em is kinda convoluted - in the throttle body, then over the top, down, then across the lifter valley and into the ports. It splits as it goes across the lifter valley and the ports where it splits are about the same size as a small block port. The main part of this restriction is about 2" long and can be milled out by going in from the top and the resulting hole in the plenum patched. I don't think there's a straight enough shot to cut it out with a cutter on a die grinder. Once that's cleared, it should handle a 454 to somewhere around 6K. I'm planning this mod on one I'm going to put in a '97 1-ton 4WD truck I'm building to pull anything I decide to hook up to it. Too bad it won't fit under a stock hood, it's not a bad looking intake. I saw one cleaned up and powder coated flat black and it looked slick enough for a 'vette, IMHO - kinda reminded me of the 90's small block TPI.

I'm Batman

I was just tossing out another option.

DIP51

This is the unit I was talking about. I just don't know if it will perform like I want it to. L88 were you referring to this unit when you described the mods you intended???

Batman..I appreciate all input. It's just that I could have bought one for cheap $$$, and was looking at this one in particular for my application. It's gone off fleabay now so I guess the hunt continues!!!

shafrs3

I made a template from an Eldebrock oval port head and layed it over the manifold, as you can see the ports are smaller by maybe 20%.

I ended up purchasing the lower half of a ramjet intake and fabricating the upper part to fit under my stock BB hood, it's been an outstanding setup. It probably flows better than any low profile oval port intake you'll find. I have no hard flow bench data to substantiate this other than my butt dyno. The upper tubes are 3" and the down tubes are slightly larger than the Edelbrock ports, no chance of restrictions.

Bullshark

I have done two FI BB since after market fuel injection became available to DIY shade tree gear heads like me. I put the Holley Commander on the 69 427 vert about the same time Zwede did his. Here the choice was pretty straight forward. I needed a carburetor style throttle body to interface with it's stock GM L-88 hood. No way was I going to alter that hood, it is probably worth more than the total FI system. Anyway, I was able to incorporate the L-88 cowl induction pretty much like it was originally designed. That has worked out ok. I had to run Alpha-N or open loop depending on what I was wanting to do with the car. The narrow band O2 sensor just would not work with the old Fireball Crane cam and the Hooker header sidepipe collectors so far from the combustion chambers. Since then Holley has provided me with their Pro Upgrade and I have been able to play with UEGO wideband O2. The Holley Commander ECU is getting kinda long in the tooth by today's standards, but one of it's nice features is that it can support rpm selectable Alpha-N / speed density operation. That really makes life easier for those wild old school cams with overlap. So, my point here is, if you need/want to maintain the L-88 cowl induction setup, go with a Holley manifold and throttle body. The Commander ECU is Ok, but I would opt for something like an Accel DFI system Gen VII or the newer Thruster configuration. You can get the ECU/wireharness for < $1k now.

If on the other hand you have an aftermarket L-88 hood with no cowl induction insert, That provides you a little more wiggle room for other options. I was really impressed with the job shafrs3 did on his crate motor, but I am getting lazy in my old age. I want the benefits of FI without all the rework. My big mistake with Project RamJet 502 was the hood miscalculation. Even though I am happy with how the hood turned out, that was a real challenge. Plus, I was trapped into having to live with GM's MEFI ECU with no ability to recalibrate the setup. One bit of advise--- Don't get into that predicament .

So let me get to the point. If I were you, with a zz454 crate and the L-88 hood (no insert). I would start with a RamJet intake setup and an aftermarket ECU/wireharness.....take your pick Accel, FAST, Bigstuff, and modify the plenum stacks to fit under the hood. It would be easy to take the plenum into a machine shop and cut 1.5" to 2" out of each stack giving you the required hood clearance. That would only have a small effect to your over all performance while not requiring you to take a hacksaw to your fiberglass. With the aftermarket EFI setup you can easily dial in your engine to accomodate the intake mod and any other mod you may want to do later on.
This is the fastest / easiest / most capable path to getting your torque monster on the road with a high level of ooh-aah Steak & Shake bling. If your time is part of the equation, I think it is one of your most affordable approaches also.

Just my humble opinion having gone down this path hitting most of the pot holes.

Bullshark

DIP51

Thanks for all the input. I am trying to get a feel for what is out there and avoid "potholes" others have hit. shafrs3...that is an awesome job!!! I will be saving that info for future use, if that is the direction I choose.

As always, this fourm is a great place to pick the minds of some very smart people. Someday I may even be able to contribute, instead of just ask for help!!!

shafrs3

Thanks, Bullshark's idea is also a good one, much less fabrication required.

CorvetteDave01

I know your asking about bb, but I did a 427 sb last summer with the FAST system. Just have it rough tuned in Alpha N atm while I am rewiring, upgrading the alternator, spal fans etc. If you go with an aftermarket, I strongly recommend going with a vender who will program a custom basemap for your motor so you can do some tuning. I used a basemap in the software and it started, but it ran so bad, I couldn't figure out what to do with it and it coated the wideband O2 sensor and took awhile till it started reading right when I paid a guy to get it rough tuned. VERY driveable setup though, more driveable even than the 383/proflo/hydraulic flattappet cam setup I had before, and this motor has a 250/258; 670/670 lift solid roller cam.

I basically converted an Edelbrock proflo efi system to work with the FAST setup, fits under the stock '76 hood too. I would not do it the same way though. Would have bought a different intake and TB as the Edelbrock TB has an odd bolt spacing and TPS, had to get a custom IAC setup too.

Shafr's setup is very nice, those TB's are a lot cheaper too, wish I had gone with something like that, sure it would have been a lot cheaper.

roscobbc

Interesting thread guys. I have '68 BB and am planning on mothballing the L36 lump and having a new 496 built-up shortly. I had also been looking at induction options. The Vortech one was looking a possibility and I remember a thread on one of the forums with a sb Vortech install. Even though it would be almost possible to get the blower head under the hood/fender the difficulties of getting cool air to the unit and the general underhood temperatures ruled it out for me. I have also been looking at injection and can see that the easier option would be a Holley/Accel/Edelbrock based system but wondered whether any of you have had experience of the Kinsler set-ips. I know they are costly but that individual runner system sure would certainly give some 'street cred' at the local cruise.

techsol

Any idea how tall this vortec bb intake is, was wondering if it would fit under the hood of my 73 with an aftermarket hood? I don't have the 2-3K for the edelbrock or holly setup's right now and it sounds like the TBI would be a poor choice, at least thats what I think I'm hearing! I'm just trying to move this puppy up into the 425-450 range