686265vette

Hi I'm thinkin when I restore my car is it easy to add a LS3 in a 65vette?
Is there any mods to the body or frame needs to be change ? And any good places you might know of crate motors for sale ? Thanks

TheGanzman

Please don't take offence (see what I did there?) to my answer, but you DO know about the conveyance called "Google Search", don't you? There is also a "Search" function on this very Forum that will yield you a plethora of results to your queries, once you master the nuances of its use...

mikey

define "easy" .. it's do-able, and can be done without frame or body mods, but everything is a process and there's no such thing as a ready made complete kit. gotta piece it together. hot rodding at it's best! I highly encourage it. my '64 has an LS2 w/TKO600 on the original frame, body and interior.
use the forum search function, there's everything you would need to know already on here. feel free to ask more specific questions as you run into the various challenges along the way.

00fxd

It's a bolt in [if you know what bolts to get ] You should be pretty handy, but all make s sense after you've it all together .....

70mph@2200rpm

"Easy" is relative, as is "expensive".
Yes, easy as everything is "off the shelf", so you are not inventing anything, and expensive as there are lots of items to purchase, and labor has to be considered, yours, and, or, others.
New frame with C-4, or later, suspension?
New wheels? yes
New paint?
New a/c?
New interior?

This is a good resource: http://www.vetterodder.com

GL

daz_au

I wonder about this quite a bit, exactly how much of a basic LS installation can be sourced off the shelf. You get bits and pieces from a google search, but has anyone listed the major steps for an LS install into a stock frame ?

GM crate motors are moving in this direction, they have complete brand new 430HP ls3 erod engines with complete wiring kits and also claim to have a sump that (quote) "Fits virtually all 1955-1995 GM front engine, RWD, V-8 cars". My understanding is that keisler and others can hook you up with a bell housing and TKO or SS700 for the back of it (none of this is cheap I know).

So what remains ?

1) Can engine mounts/adapters be bought to put the motor in a stock position so that the shifter and tailshaft are in the right place ?

2) Some kind of belt setup, in my case only for an alternator.

3) Fuel system, I assume at least a pump and return line

4) Exhaust - not sure if stock ls headers work, presume rest can be custom made

5) Is stock steering and brake hardware in the way ?

6) Dewitts makes a stock mounting radiator with LS plumbing right ?

7) Intake, convert tach to electric, hydraulic clutch ?

00fxd

Waste of time and money. Stock clutch with the Scoggins Dickey Z bar adapter mount works just fine

70mph@2200rpm

daz au...

Here is a link to an article from Vette magazine, circa 2009, that I read and kept as a reference, an LS swap using the stock frame:
http://www.hotrodlane.cc/65_red_vette.pdf

Two years ago I purchased a frame off, rotisserie, 65 coupe. It was restored in 1994, but had only been driven 600 miles up to early 2011. It had a NOM 327/300. My plan was to install an LS drive train on a SRlll frame, sell the immaculate rolling chassis for top dollar ($10K ?), and not need to do any other restoration to the car, other than after market seats, stereo, etc.
I spent almost 2 years researching all of the options, prior to purchasing this car, and another 6 months after, and SRlll was my first choice. Mike quoted me $48k, "out the door", for the complete LS3/4L65e swap with C-4 frame, including tilt, a/c, and basic 17" wheels. By the time I decided to do it, Mike was already 6 months back logged (Street Shop quoted me $45K, but then Trey never returned my e-mail or voice mails). That gave me time to think about using my restored frame and possibly saving some money, and saving even more with a used
LS-2/4L60e, etc. I found a local shop that had done LS swaps on various classics, including a 56 vette, and he quoted me approx.$21k.
It turned out he was about $8k short in his estimate, and I added another $3k in misc. items, including a Borgeson steering box and Hydroboost . After he completed the swap and had it running, I then added posi and 17" wheels. So at that point I was close to $38k, minus the sale of my 327 w/powerglide.
With the sale of the rolling chassis, I could have had the SRllll swap for about the same cost, and with a new drive train, rear end, and larger brakes, to boot.
However, I am very satisfied and happy with what I have!! ...YMMV (your mileage may vary).

John S 1961

Not easy, you must change everything that is part of the powertrain and cooling systems. Not one single part will bolt up, wire up or fit up to anything existing.

Or its as easy as writing checks for those inclined with an adequate budget.

Have you considered a nice ZZ383 and a five speed?

groovyjay

Got a LS6 in my 65 and LS3 in my 63 and will put LS something to all my future builds...

TheGanzman

I am on the CUSP of doing this in my '67 Coupe - hope to start in on it ~September/October, co-inciding w/my Keisler SS 700 delivery. Here's what I've come up w/so far:

- Rick's Tanks in NM for the tank - mine will have an in-tank fuel pump, return line, and provisions for an evaporative cannister from II Much Fabrication
- LS radiator/fan setup from DeWitt's
- LS376/525 Crate Motor from JEG's
- Hydraulic clutch mod
- Art Morrison Motor Mounts
- Drive by wire throttle
- Stock gauges converted by Redline
- Labor to install all of the above; I'm too old to do this anymore!


I'm guesstimating ~$20-25K, not counting the transmission - I'll be doing some mods/upgrades to the engine (aluminum intake, cast aluminum valve covers, hiding the coils, etc.) - I'm BRACED for more. When you start adding up all the "hidden" stuff, it adds up FAST!

Joe Inama

Resto Mod Corvettes are the hot rods of the future. Do it correctly and you wont loose any money. Awesome, happy to see the interest.

dcaggiani

Scope creep will set in and the dollars keep on rolling out.
In general - 30-40K for a rolling chassis, 30-40k in work/materials, plus the purchase of the Vette another 30-40k.
So worth it though !!!!

70mph@2200rpm

Here is my invoice...ymmv

TheGanzman

I just threw up alittle in my mouth...

VERY sobering when you see it in black & white "line item" format...

mrtexas

What is to gain other than bragging rights with an LS3 and later model transmission over a stock 327 and Keisler 5sp say modified with up to date heads, cam, intake, and multi-port fuel injection?

I have a stock 327 and Keisler 5sp and am considering a First Fuel Injection multi-port setup if they ever put them in to production. That setup looks to me at first glance a lot like a later model LS setup.

How much is there to gain with a later model suspension vs the stock C2 say modified with later model brakes and wheels?

TheGanzman

Well, let's see:

- ~100+ pounds lighter
- LS engine runs more smoothly due to more efficient firing order
- LS engine makes more horespower/torque MUCH more efficiently
- LS engine gets better fuel mileage than the BEST Gen 1 engine
- LS engine holds fluids better; MUCH less prone to leakage
- LS engine cools more efficiently
- LS engine lubricates internal parts more efficiently; as such, engine life is greatly increased
- LS fuel injection is MUCH more efficient - ECM "polls" & makes fuel-air corrections MANY more times than the best add-on fuel injection

Those are just a few, off the top of my head...

70mph@2200rpm

"What is to gain other than bragging rights with an LS3 and later model transmission over a stock 327 and Keisler 5sp say modified with up to date heads, cam, intake, and multi-port fuel injection?"

Bragging rights come with an LS-9 in a C2...yeehaaww!

mrtexas

Thank you. I really did not know what the benefits were and was not trying to start any drama! What you are saying is the LS is a more modern engine

70mph@2200rpm

I thought you'd enjoy that...I never thought that I'd invest that much money, but fortunately I had it, and luckily I am quite satisfied with the end result.
The LS drive train is well worth all the effort and costs.