macdarren

I am sure this has come up before...but I have never seen it.

My passenger side door is closed and will not open.
The lock **** will turn though it is a bit stiff (always has been)
With the window down I can see the link rod move up and down
with the lock ****'s motion...it appears to be attached at both ends.
Key has pretty much the same effect.
I believe the problem is in the latch or opening linkage.

I can't see much but pulling the interior release or
pushing the external button seem to move things and feel about right when the know is in the unlocked position but the door seems to remain firmly latched and can't be opened.


I'm at a loss on how to proceed...removing the door panel from inside with the door closed seems pretty difficult maybe impossible without damaging it. I don't see an obvious way to release the catch looking down the window opening but I am hoping there is a way. Never had much practice with a SlimJim but not sure if the linkages are detached or if the latch is stuck it would even work.

Any suggestions?

Thanks
Darren

Stingray1967

I'm guessing that the rod that actuates the latch isn't connected anymore.

With the window down, using a flashlight, watch the mechanism while you pull on the door release. That is the rod you need to move. If it is moving some now, see if you can get it to move more. Perhaps the mechanism is only partially actuating the latch and not getting it far enough to disengage the door. You'll need something long and thin to get in there.

Also, when you close the door, does it sound/feel like the latch on the door is dragging on the receiver on the body jamb? If so, the receiver on the body jamb isn't adjusted right (probably sitting too high on the car) You can back out the three phillips screws on the body jamb receiver and drop it 1/8" or 1/4" to make that better.

You can try taking the door panel off from inside the car, but I think you'll just damage it. There are two screws on the front of the door jamb, and three across the bottom that are COMPLETELY covered up when the door is closed.

Something else to try. Run the window down, go outside the car. At the same time, pull on the door release through the open window and push on the exterior door handle button. Then, while lifting UP on the door handle, try and open the door.

midyear

OK,

the most common thing I find is when the lock wont release/unlock, this is often caused by a broken or weak spring on the latch for the "paddle" the pin/rod on the outside door handle pushes against. with the window down, find something you can use to push the "paddle" towards the outside door handle, then try and unlock it and then hopefully the outside handle will now open your door. I find this is common on old latch's.

macdarren

Thanks guys, I'll give both of these techniques a try when I get home tonight.
Wish I had paid more attention to how things worked last time I had the panels off.
I'll dig out the assembly and service manuals and see if I can find some pictures
to guide me while I am poking and prodding things to see I can get the door released.

Another probably not so helpful piece of information is that apparently the passenger side door has been a bit challenging to open from the inside for some time. I seldom ride shotgun and usually open it from the outside with no problem but I guess the inside release has been kinda 'hard' for a while. Since neither the inside or outside release works I am thinking it is locked or the mechanism is jammed. The passenger door has always been the better closing of the two it just snicks shut and is looks nicely aligned. The driver door has always been the one I sometimes had to open and re-close and no amount of adjusting ever got it to look as nice or close and latch as well as that passenger door.

Stingray1967

Just read your post on door alignment. Just because the whole DOOR is aligned to the BODY, doesn't mean that the latch is aligned to the door jamb......

macdarren

oh, I understand that....my comment was just to the fact that the door that is now giving my the problem always seemed to be perfectly aligned both visually and with the latch and door jamb. It closed with a nice snick and opened just as it should. (with the exception I guess that from inside it has been hard to get it to release in the past so maybe that was a sign something was up but I just didn't realize as it opened and closed fine from the outside)

PaulUptime

Unlike those who have offered the other helpful replies I've never been through this. Those suggestions all make sense, but another thing I was thinking is that if it's a convertible, put a floor jack under the rear sill of the passenger side frame and lift it a bit.

You never know, but doing so might relieve some binding just from body flex, hopefully making it easier to disengage the latch.

macdarren

Hey I like that idea.....as it happens it is a convertible and I know lifting the car in various points does in fact change how the doors latch. In fact as it happens the last time that door was opened might have been before the work I did on the starter which required lifting the front right corner under that now jammed door so maybe something shifted during that lift and I never noticed until now....

firstgear

If you had a C1, I have been stuck a couple times, once even at goodguys it would not open and had to take the door panel off and open from inside. After that time I bought reproduction door latches and have not had a problem since.

macdarren

I finally had a chance to spend some time fooling with my stuck door.

And yes it is still stuck....arrrrgh!


From what I can tell looking in from the window slit, everything seems to be working and moving same as it does in the door that works. I seems like either the little gear wheel (I don't know what to call it) is either not releasing so it can spin and allow the door to open or somehow the latch is caught in some in-between point. I say that because it feels a bit funny like it is just not quite moving far enough for release and as I first depress the button there it seems easier only after about half the travel is taken up does it feel like the other side then it continues inward but the door never releases.

Is it possible the part attached to the door frame has slipped such that the door can't open even with the catch released?

I tried driving it some hoping it might jiggle something into a more cooperative state. I tried lifting it from various point to see if it would flex and unstick. I even lifting it and then dropped the jack to give it a good bounce but it will not budge. It is firmly latched with zero play.

So no what? I would really prefer not to cut up a basically new door panel but that is all I can think of to get to the mechanism.

Anyone have some detailed photos of how everything moves and works?
I had such a hard time getting the panels on I am reluctant to pull the other door panel to see if I can get any clues but that might be the next step.

Maybe there is some point I can pry, pull, press or jar from the window slit that might allow that latch to open? I tried moving all the things I could reach that seemed like they moved when the button is pressed trying to get them to go just a bit more but none really seem to move.

TIA
Darren

macdarren

ttt

Anyone ever tried removing a door panel with the door closed?

Thinking it might be possible to basically pull it free of the lower clips,
bend it out a bit and get to the access panel and somehow get the door released then remove and repair the back side of the panel.

JoeCool66

These are pics I took of my ’66 as part of my disassembly prior to paint. Hope they give you some guidance. Good Luck

Joe

midyear

still bet its stuck in lock position...

JoeCool66

I would say don't try it. You're bound to cause damage. I would attempt to open through the top (protecting glass and paint with some tape). You may need to make your own slim jim or the old standard coat hanger.

The thing that looks like a pinwheel is what actually holds the door closed. The flat pad bracket where my door handle should be is what you are pushing when you push the outside door handle button. Make sure that is being fully engaged.

I'm with midyear... I would focus on making sure you are really unlocked.

PaulUptime

x2 - Don't start hacking at the panel until you are certain it's not just locked.

If you have a AAA membership (and with an old car, why wouldn't you?) perhaps you can put a call out for an experienced lock-opener. These guys can get a door opened with a slim jim faster than with a key. You can also drive it to an experienced locksmith and get him to do it. Just find a way to put this matter into the hands of the more experienced before you do any "car"nage.

macdarren

I'm posting this just in case anyone else ever has the stuck door problem.

It has taken me a while to get back to this but I spent several hours on it this weekend and have a few things to share.

First a good bright LED flashlight is a wonderful thing! Everyone should have several, they make seeing into the door through the window slot much easier.

Using the aforementioned flashlight and moving back and forth between the doors I was able to see at least some of how the mechanism is supposed to work.

Many, myself included, suspected the lock was the culprit however it never really felt like that was the case...I could tell pushing the outside button that there was a difference between locked and unlocked states. I could see the lock mechanism working for the most part and could using a long thin rod lock and unlock via the window opening. Next I was certain the problem was with the little spinning latch mechanism, that it was not being released or was somehow jammed. I could just see the tip of the star wheel that releases the latch from the window opening. Using a long thin steel rod I could move the release directly. This had no effect and I could see that when the lock was unlocked that the release button did the same motion...all the mechanisms seemed to be doing their jobs but the latch would not release.

At this point I was sure something was just frozen in the latch and was about to give up. Just to leave no stone unturned I put a floor jack under the frame near the body mount point behind the door and lifted the car from that point only. In the past I have seen that there is enough flex in the frame that the seams of the door and body shift a bit when you do this. I had tried this previously but lifted from the front body mount point, trying to get the door unstuck. Even dropping the jack suddenly to try to get things loose. This time I noted that the rear door seam didn't seem to change much...normally a good thing but not what I had remembered.

I held the button and jerked a few times on the door, pushing it in and out just hoping something would let loose and I noted that while on the ground the door was frozen solid and didn't budge, now it maybe moved just the smallest amount....so up on the jack more lifting the car off the ground on that side by that single point and pushing and pulling and suddenly she opens....YEAH!!!!!

Now what was the problem...do I dare ever close the door again?

The latching mechanism seems to work fine releasing as expected and locking and unlocking....I lubed everything just for good measure.

Holding the release I slowly close the door and opened it again and I can feel the latching mechanism turning but nothing is sticking.....so far so good. Next I put in on the ground and try it, now I can feel a sort of resistance just as the door reaches it's fully closed position...I am still holding the latch in the released position and even then there is a slight stick as the door closes. I am sure the latch on the body has shifted or something and start trying to make some minor adjustments but nothing I do helps...then it dawns on me....I look up a bit at the bumper plates mounted to the door and body and see now what has happened....somehow these have worn and arranged themselves so that when the door is fully closed their wear points slip past each other and as the door settles in it's closed position they can lock together. Had I really slammed the door instead of holding the release and just pressing it closed I am sure it would have locked up again. When on the ground closing it firmly caused enough of a stick when I went to pull it back open that I could tell it was just short of the point of lockup.

Removing one shim under the door's bumper plate solved everything except for the fact that what was once a perfect closing door is now not quite so perfect...it used to close with just a snick and latch and now it is more of a clank clunk like the other door. I expect this is the result of my messing with the latch position on the body so maybe I can get right again but still it is much better than fused shut.

So the moral is keep and eye on those bumpers and if the door is stuck you can easily see them (at least on a convertible) and probably could have persuaded them to release and if all else fails flexing the body with the jack turned out to be a good trick.

In closing I expect all this happened as a result of some work on the starter of all things....I had lifted the car from the passenger side only just so I could get under and check the starter and I suspect this flexed the frame/body enough to cause the bumper plates to move into their locked up position.

Darren

ejboyd5

Good work and thanks for the follow up.

dahogan

normally I wouldnt read such a long post, but this was interesting

PaulUptime

Me the idiot had the winning solution!
From my reply Sept 6

Glad you got it open macdarren, and solved the riddle too.
Good advice to check the door bumpers to ensure they never interlock. This was the first I've heard of this happening but something I'll remember...

macdarren

Thanks for the winning solution....

I had tried this flex trick before but I was not as tuned in at the time or didn't get it high enough to notice the slight give I noted this time.

I am sure glad I didn't cut the door panel...as it turned out since it was not the latch but the bumpers even had I destroyed the panel and gotten into the door mechanism it still would not have opened I would have ruined the panel for nothing!