65tripleblack

Well, I took the little beastie to Raceway Park Wednesday evening since Wednesday nights are for unmuffled cars. Boy, oh boy, those QTP electric cutout valves are a PLEASURE.........sure beats crawling underneath and removing 6 nuts/bolts, 2 of which were right up against the frame and a BEAR to get to, especially on the ground.

Car and driver weighed in at 3310 pounds, exactly.
Temp was 82 degrees, with relative humidity @ 36% for run #1
Temp was 81 degrees, with relative humidity @ 40% for run #2
Shift point was 6500 for run #1
Shift point was 6750 for run #2
Launch for run #1 resulted in moderate wheelspin
Launch for run #2 resulted in moderate bog

Shifts were not rushed, and uneventful for both runs. Car went through the traps in 3rd gear, near 6500 both times.

Run #1: 13.07 @ 110.24 MPH.............7:14 PM
Run #2: 13.40 @ 111.15 MPH.............7:42 PM

Coolant leak after run #2 was traced to 2 loosened water pump bolts. Tightened but still weeping at the gasket caused cancellation of more runs.

Because the MPH increased so dramatically in run #2, and the shift points were higher, I planned on shifting @ 7000 for run #3. That will have to remain for next time. Engine ran strongly both times, thank heaven!

Unfortunately, I have no trailer, nor do I have a pit crew, nor room for more than a few basic tools. If I break something, then I'm at the mercy of the flatbed operator. Prudence will take precedence.....................to a certain degree.
__________________

6T5RUSH

Joe,

I remember you talking about installing electric cutouts. They are the "bees knees" don't you know! Looking at your trap times I think if you can minimize wheel spin like your first pass and shift closer to 7,000 r's you'll be in the 12's. Very stout nonetheless. I'm impressed! The small block that never stops spinnin'! Sweet!

Yeh, I can relate. I've driven to a track once with my '5 and then sweat bullets about possibly breaking something because I too had driven to the event and participated. This was well over a 100 miles from home. Not fun if you do have a breakdown.

Again, you've got a powerhouse there!



Regards,

Jim
In God We Trust!

vetrod62

111 mph should yield a 12.2 ET , if you can hook it up and shift fast.

65tripleblack

Jim and Jim,

The biggest hurdle right now is for me to come up with a decent launch strategy. For the time being, the car is equipped with a 3.70 gear and a close ratio Muncie. The tires are Goodyear reproduction bias ply 7.75-15 goldlines which I'm having fun doing burnouts and such with. Very soon they'll be "baloneys", and they'll be gone.

I'd sure like to powershift it at 7000, but I don't think the trans will take the punisnment. I'm shifting leisurely, especially since the 1-2 synchro is weak. I get gear clash when shifting "briskly" into 2nd. Last year I had 85W-140 in the trans and this year I'm using 80W-90. The gear clash is worse with the normal gear oil.

The car goes thru the traps at 6500 RPM, in third gear. The little 327 pulls like a bastard.

Jim K..................your LT1 will make a damn sight more power if you port the hell out of those 461's. You're enjoying the Pure Stock class, so external changes are out of the question. Unfortunately, there ain't much that can be done to the 461 intake. Brezezinski won't touch it and told me a long time ago that the low horse, spread bore cast iron manifold can easily be made to flow better. I can imagine that your "mule motor" is a sweet running little bitch, though! It makes a huge difference with better manifolds on both inlet and exhaust sides. Top it off with a 750 DP and you'll be in 327 heaven. OOOOps, I hope that name isn't copyrighted!

427Hotrod

Sweet running 327 for sure! Looks like about 365-375 flywheel HP showing up with those shift points. I bet it will like a little more RPM like you said.

We put together a .060 over 327 for a buddy's '65 with a bunch of stuff we had around. It had 11.0 compression and a set of World Products 170 cc SR Torquer iron heads. We used a little Crower circle track cam that would drive perfect and rev to the moon. It had an old Tarantula intake and a 750 DP and headers running through 2.5" pipes. With 3.36's it ran high 12's@112-113 mph or so in TX summertime heat. Really fun little motor. He had 255/60 street radials on it..so a lot more tire than you're getting it done with and he banged on the poor old Muncie pretty hard on the shifts. Really didn't have any hand work at all...just put together.

You've worked hard to get that combo selected and it shows. That's got to be a heck of a lot of fun with the sleeper look and letting that engine scream like they are supposed to do. With killer NJ air coming later this fall you're going to pick up even more MPH!

Congratulations!

JIM

Westlotorn

Those trap speeds are really impressive, your 327 is really running strong.
Keep us posted on the future improvements as you sort it out.

vetrod62

Do not cut the muncie trans short. (1966 and up) It is stronger than reported. Most of the fast guys in our NJO series use them and all hook up with wheels off the ground, one with 434 CI. No one has broken one yet. If your trans is crunching into 2nd, Get it fixed before it does more damage. Probably 2nd gear, slider and ring.

The Sting Ray rears are not my thing, but I have friend who has a 66 440 inch coupe that is blown , 11" sticky tires that beats on it without blowing it. He did up grade to L-88 axles years ago.

If It were me, I would find some skinny by 26" real slicks that fit in the wheel wells and put in a wide ratio trans. ( also I would put in some 4.30 or 4.56 gears, but that is just me) and race it.

Think Saturday July 30, Corvette Day at ETown. We should have some of our fastest cars there that day for the drag racing part of the Go and Show event.

We will be looking for you.

midyearvette

man, those are great numbers for a shake down trial!.....i agree with everyone about the great trap speed....you have a nice baseline to work with and it sounds like you did your homework on components.....what gear are you using.....336??.....

65tripleblack

I'll look forward to meeting you if I go that day. Hopefully you or someone else will post a heads up when the time gets close, to remind all of us "memory challenged" folks to be there.

The Muncie will be abandoned next year, so I won't be taking it apart again this year.

The plan is to install a Richmond ROD six speed with the following gearset: 3.04;2.13;1.57;1.24;1.00;.76, which, while retaining the 3.70 will give me the equivalent of a close ratio Muncie with 4.56 axle while driving gears 1-4 (which is all I'd be using when at the track). Add fifth and sixth @ 1:1 and .76 with the 3.70 and you have huge torque multiplication in 1-4, then a direct drive fifth, and a nice .76:1 OD in sixth. It ain't gonna be easy getting it to fit without cutting the tunnel. If I have to, I'll raise the car off the mounts to provide clearance. It should be worth the trouble, though..................especially because I like to take this car on long trips. After that, comes the oil cooler and then the new Vintage Air. Not to mention the fact that I'll be banned from the track unless I restore and install my hard top.

Heading out to Long Branch for the Father's Day "Cruise to the Joizey Shore"..................a very nice family event featuring about 100 or so classic cars, live oldies music, food, etc at the Promenade, near Rooneys at the Long Branch shorefront.

Donny Brass

Joe,

that is hauling the mail, for sure...

congrats

365GTB4

Take a look at the tremec TKO 500. I run one in my 64 365/327 and love the gearing. No problem with clearance, just bolt it in. I run 3:36 gears. I use to have 4:11 with the muncie. Your times are outstanding. Better than anything I ran back in day with cheater slicks.

vetrod62

I have a Richmond ROD 6 in my blown BBC. Nice trans for cruising. But way too slow on shifting for drag racing. I had a TKO600 in the black car and it was also too slow shifting. My guess, too much rotating mass. I picked up 3/10s by switching to a Muncie. If I was to choose the ROD6 vs the TKO600, I would go for the TKO. If you have lots of power, you do not so many trans gears.

65tripleblack

I've looked at it, and also looked at the new T45 based Keisler RS, both of which are top loader rail shifters. Both are good, although some have reported balky shifting with them. Although the TKO/RS provide the much needed overdrive 5th gear, neither of which combines that desirable quality with an additional, lower gear, which effectively numerically raises the axle ratio. As I explained in the post above, the gearing I selected for the ROD will effectively give me (3.04 x 3.70) 11.248:1 torque multiplication when in first gear, which is the same as the C/R Muncie with a 5.11 axle (2.20 x 5.11). Gears 2-4 are selected with very tight intergear ratios of about .70 .75, which is where the M21/M22 fall within.

I also prefer the external shift linkage over the rail job, and will specify the Long shifter with the Richmond. Finally, it is supposed to be located in the same place within the console, and supposedly requires no mods.

65tripleblack

That's surprising. Thanks for the heads-up, since I never heard this before! I'll take a close look at that.
What are you using for gear oil? Do you have a Long shifter?

What do you call "slow"? I fully release the clutch and throttle when shifting. I would estimate that it takes me (about) .33 sec between shifts with the Muncie.

65tripleblack

Hey Donny.................

And you're not too shabby either with your pure stocker. Very impressive 105 MPH trap speed and low 13's with an L79 is something to be proud of!

rj8806

Yes the TKO and the T45 are internal rail shifter linkage but that's where the similarities end. The TKO has 3 main rails that the 1-2, 3-4 and 5-reverse shift forks hang from (1 fork per rail) and then you have a 4th rail that connects those 3 rails to the actual shifter.

This is why some guys experience or feel the "notchy" shift quality. The good news is the "notchiness" loosens up over the breakin period and then it shifts like a hot knife thru butter in most cases.

The T45 has 1 main rail that ALL the shift forks swing from and that same rail is connected to the shifter, just like the T56 6-speeds. For this reason, the T45 and T56's shift silky smooth right out of the gate (assuming you don't add a side mounted shifter (like for vettes). This means you have a shifter "box" that has been offset from the centerline of the tail housing and therefore, uses a link to connect the shifter back to the shifter rail. This method has produced varying questions about the "smoothness".

Hopefully that cleared up some of the questions.


Richard

Scott Marzahl

Thanks for the update Joe, it sounds like that new motor just keeps getting better!

vetrod62

Now that is tough to estimate. I also have to fully use the clutch. I can do throttle down or lift slightly, makes no difference in ET. But I keep my friction point up really high. I can make the shifts sound like an automatic with the Muncie. The ROD6 or TKO seam to be 3 times slower. If you want to see really fast shifts, try a Crash box.

Gear oil in the Muncie is old style 90 Wt. Synthetics are too slippery for fast shifting. The other trans', I use what is recommended by the manufacture.

The ROD6 has a Long shifter and a shortest stick and arms.

65tripleblack

First few years I had 90W-140 in the Muncie. Last year I changed to 85W-90. It seems like it shifted equally as well with either oil once it heated up. What became more noticeable was the gear clash when quick shifting into second since I got rid of the truck oil and filled with the normal weight. If I take my time with the 1-2 shift there is no clash (a very short, maybe 1/4 second "buzz" which is felt in the shifter as well as being audible).

There is no question that I'll use the Richmond. I don't care if the shifts are marginally quicker with the Muncie, or not. As I said......................I don't shift very quickly as it is, now. I have no intention of powershifting in any event. I don't trust myself with my shifting skill, and don't look forward to the possibility of missed shifts and blown engines.

Donny Brass

these 327 are tougher than you think........