Whats gonna happen in 20-30 years
05-09-2011, 07:23 PM
#61
Tech Contributor
05-09-2011, 09:01 PM
#62
Melting Slicks
For the same reason many appearantly affluent guys express the desire to own one but can't.
1-They either can't or won't finance a 50 yr old car (their Bimmer and everything else is fiananced on 7 yr terms etc.).
2-The wife won't let him.
3-His over extended finances won't let him.
4-Kids still have to get throguh college.
5- Can't do the work himself and spend 50 grand plus the price of the car.
6-He's just stroking you.
7-BMWs are worthless on the used market. Ever try to sell one?
8-all of the above.
1-They either can't or won't finance a 50 yr old car (their Bimmer and everything else is fiananced on 7 yr terms etc.).
2-The wife won't let him.
3-His over extended finances won't let him.
4-Kids still have to get throguh college.
5- Can't do the work himself and spend 50 grand plus the price of the car.
6-He's just stroking you.
7-BMWs are worthless on the used market. Ever try to sell one?
8-all of the above.
05-09-2011, 11:02 PM
#63
Le Mans Master
It's interesting living near Carlisle. I've been going to shows for years. The main crowd is definitely not the younger crowd. I've run into a lot of my son's friends Dad's at show looking for cars for their kids. Although, seeinign how they run in the same crowd, I don't see any cars.
My son would love a Chevelle. I have no problem with that. When he was younger he loved being involved in my vettes. But alas, as he goes into his teens (17 right now), he thinks with something else, and would rather spend time on the computer than do anything else
I've tried but it's a no go at this time in his life. Maybe someday he'll get the itch, but I doubt it
My son would love a Chevelle. I have no problem with that. When he was younger he loved being involved in my vettes. But alas, as he goes into his teens (17 right now), he thinks with something else, and would rather spend time on the computer than do anything else
I've tried but it's a no go at this time in his life. Maybe someday he'll get the itch, but I doubt it
05-10-2011, 01:38 PM
#65
It's interesting living near Carlisle. I've been going to shows for years. The main crowd is definitely not the younger crowd. I've run into a lot of my son's friends Dad's at show looking for cars for their kids. Although, seeinign how they run in the same crowd, I don't see any cars.
My son would love a Chevelle. I have no problem with that. When he was younger he loved being involved in my vettes. But alas, as he goes into his teens (17 right now), he thinks with something else, and would rather spend time on the computer than do anything else
I've tried but it's a no go at this time in his life. Maybe someday he'll get the itch, but I doubt it
My son would love a Chevelle. I have no problem with that. When he was younger he loved being involved in my vettes. But alas, as he goes into his teens (17 right now), he thinks with something else, and would rather spend time on the computer than do anything else
I've tried but it's a no go at this time in his life. Maybe someday he'll get the itch, but I doubt it
05-10-2011, 03:27 PM
#66
Melting Slicks
This is a great thread. I'm 48 years old and given my observations at local car shows on the younger side of the C2 distribution curve.
When I bought my vette 6 months ago I was looking at Ferrari's, Audi R8's and could have afforded either.
The reason I decided on an old vette and not a new super car was mainly due to the feeling I get when I see someone driving one vs the feeling I get when I see someone driving a classic.
I think the line from gone in 60 seconds sums it up for me:
Memphis: Roger, I have a problem...
Roger the Car Salesman: Yes?
Memphis: I've been in L.A. for three months now. I have money, I have taste. But I'm not on anybody's "A" list, and Saturday night is the loneliest night for the week for me.
Roger the Car Salesman: Well, a Ferrari would certainly change that.
Memphis: Perhaps, Mmmm. But, you know, this is the one. Yes, yes yes... I saw three of these parked outside the local Starbucks this morning, which tells me only one thing. There's too many self-Indulgent wieners in this city with too much bloody money! Now, if I was driving a 1967 275 GTB four-cam...
Roger the Car Salesman: You would not be a self-indulgent wiener, sir... You'd be a connoisseur.
Memphis: Precisely. Champagne would fall from the heavens. Doors would open. Velvet ropes would part.
When I bought my vette 6 months ago I was looking at Ferrari's, Audi R8's and could have afforded either.
The reason I decided on an old vette and not a new super car was mainly due to the feeling I get when I see someone driving one vs the feeling I get when I see someone driving a classic.
I think the line from gone in 60 seconds sums it up for me:
Memphis: Roger, I have a problem...
Roger the Car Salesman: Yes?
Memphis: I've been in L.A. for three months now. I have money, I have taste. But I'm not on anybody's "A" list, and Saturday night is the loneliest night for the week for me.
Roger the Car Salesman: Well, a Ferrari would certainly change that.
Memphis: Perhaps, Mmmm. But, you know, this is the one. Yes, yes yes... I saw three of these parked outside the local Starbucks this morning, which tells me only one thing. There's too many self-Indulgent wieners in this city with too much bloody money! Now, if I was driving a 1967 275 GTB four-cam...
Roger the Car Salesman: You would not be a self-indulgent wiener, sir... You'd be a connoisseur.
Memphis: Precisely. Champagne would fall from the heavens. Doors would open. Velvet ropes would part.
05-10-2011, 05:26 PM
#67
Le Mans Master
This is a great thread. I'm 48 years old and given my observations at local car shows on the younger side of the C2 distribution curve.
When I bought my vette 6 months ago I was looking at Ferrari's, Audi R8's and could have afforded either.
The reason I decided on an old vette and not a new super car was mainly due to the feeling I get when I see someone driving one vs the feeling I get when I see someone driving a classic.
I think the line from gone in 60 seconds sums it up for me:
Memphis: Roger, I have a problem...
Roger the Car Salesman: Yes?
Memphis: I've been in L.A. for three months now. I have money, I have taste. But I'm not on anybody's "A" list, and Saturday night is the loneliest night for the week for me.
Roger the Car Salesman: Well, a Ferrari would certainly change that.
Memphis: Perhaps, Mmmm. But, you know, this is the one. Yes, yes yes... I saw three of these parked outside the local Starbucks this morning, which tells me only one thing. There's too many self-Indulgent wieners in this city with too much bloody money! Now, if I was driving a 1967 275 GTB four-cam...
Roger the Car Salesman: You would not be a self-indulgent wiener, sir... You'd be a connoisseur.
Memphis: Precisely. Champagne would fall from the heavens. Doors would open. Velvet ropes would part.
When I bought my vette 6 months ago I was looking at Ferrari's, Audi R8's and could have afforded either.
The reason I decided on an old vette and not a new super car was mainly due to the feeling I get when I see someone driving one vs the feeling I get when I see someone driving a classic.
I think the line from gone in 60 seconds sums it up for me:
Memphis: Roger, I have a problem...
Roger the Car Salesman: Yes?
Memphis: I've been in L.A. for three months now. I have money, I have taste. But I'm not on anybody's "A" list, and Saturday night is the loneliest night for the week for me.
Roger the Car Salesman: Well, a Ferrari would certainly change that.
Memphis: Perhaps, Mmmm. But, you know, this is the one. Yes, yes yes... I saw three of these parked outside the local Starbucks this morning, which tells me only one thing. There's too many self-Indulgent wieners in this city with too much bloody money! Now, if I was driving a 1967 275 GTB four-cam...
Roger the Car Salesman: You would not be a self-indulgent wiener, sir... You'd be a connoisseur.
Memphis: Precisely. Champagne would fall from the heavens. Doors would open. Velvet ropes would part.
The reaction I get from all those "supercar" owners. Tells me the C2 has lost none of it's charisma. Quite the contrary.It seems to be gaining.
05-10-2011, 05:54 PM
#70
Le Mans Master
The BMWs were by far the hardest to re-sell. It's mainly due to their built in service intervals and parts that self destruct at key mileage intervals(ie: $1 window regulator retaining clips.(Most mechanics including the dealer charge you $500+ for a new regulator. Or the oil dip stick drain valve that causes prodigous oil burning around 150K miles. Dealers tend to re-build the motor instead of a $400 parts change. It goes on and on). Many manufacturers do this. BMW is the worst of the perps. And it reflects in their re-sale.
I will say my daughters properly maintained 2001 X5 has a 170k miles and is by far the most reliable and solid of my other high mileage cars. Tahoe,Jeep Grand cherokee.PS. Those other Supercars devalue like Las Vegas real estate.
Last edited by MiguelsC2; 05-10-2011 at 06:03 PM.
05-10-2011, 09:17 PM
#71
Le Mans Master
It's a love hate relationship.Gone are the days of going to Sears and buying a good set of Craftsman tools and going to town. Hell I remember the days when I had my first car, a '71 Chevelle, that, at the time I didn't know, had a distributor that the shaft cracked. I kept losing dwell on it. I carried an allen wrench in the glove box. My buddies and I took it to Asbury Park NJ one weekend. In a toll booth on the NJ Turnpike the car acted up. Told my shotgun rider to grab the allen wrench out of the glove box for me. Opened the hood, and set the dwell so she was running right. Got home and put the dwell meter on it. 32 degrees on the money, right where it should have been.
Today, ya need a BS in Comp Sci (
which I have) to figure the damn things out. 
05-11-2011, 01:55 AM
#72
Le Mans Master
Heres a better way to see this whole value when we're dead thing.
Look at ANY true high performance car from ANY era.
Have they gone down in value because the generations that created and lusted for them are dead? I think not.
The lust lives on, long after our sorry a$$es are in the grave!
Look at ANY true high performance car from ANY era.
Have they gone down in value because the generations that created and lusted for them are dead? I think not.
The lust lives on, long after our sorry a$$es are in the grave!
05-11-2011, 08:22 AM
#73
Race Director
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At least "mechanics" that know cars and not the "pull what I think is the part that is bad" type of people. I know cars have become a computer nightmare. i know that for a fact with my ZR-1. It's a love hate relationship.
Gone are the days of going to Sears and buying a good set of Craftsman tools and going to town. Hell I remember the days when I had my first car, a '71 Chevelle, that, at the time I didn't know, had a distributor that the shaft cracked. I kept losing dwell on it. I carried an allen wrench in the glove box. My buddies and I took it to Asbury Park NJ one weekend. In a toll booth on the NJ Turnpike the car acted up. Told my shotgun rider to grab the allen wrench out of the glove box for me. Opened the hood, and set the dwell so she was running right. Got home and put the dwell meter on it. 32 degrees on the money, right where it should have been.
Today, ya need a BS in Comp Sci ( which I have) to figure the damn things out.
It's a love hate relationship.Gone are the days of going to Sears and buying a good set of Craftsman tools and going to town. Hell I remember the days when I had my first car, a '71 Chevelle, that, at the time I didn't know, had a distributor that the shaft cracked. I kept losing dwell on it. I carried an allen wrench in the glove box. My buddies and I took it to Asbury Park NJ one weekend. In a toll booth on the NJ Turnpike the car acted up. Told my shotgun rider to grab the allen wrench out of the glove box for me. Opened the hood, and set the dwell so she was running right. Got home and put the dwell meter on it. 32 degrees on the money, right where it should have been.
Today, ya need a BS in Comp Sci (
which I have) to figure the damn things out. I frequently read, and respond to, questions that some people ask about fundamental mechanics which just staggers my mind. Yes, yes, yes, I fully realize that not everyone here grew up with a crescent wrench and a screwdriver in each hand. But also, so many things are just plain ole simple mechanics and I often don't understand why some people don't grasp what needs to be done. The older cars without computers are simple to diagnose and simple to repair. Conversely, today's cars require expensive computer diagnostic equipment and a method to interpret the codes. Once the problem is found (IF it is found), the repair is USUALLY an expensive part replacement instead of just being able to repair the affected part.
Today there are MANY vendors selling parts and components to upgrade the older cars, and the end result of MOST upgrades is still basic mechanics. One such upgrade is converting from drums to discs. An old AM radio can be replaced with a nice stereo system which requires some added wiring and speaker installation, but it still does not require a sophisticated computer system. It seems that almost everything computer related in our late model Impala goes through the damn radio. What happens when the damn radio quits???????????
I also spend some time on the classic Chevy forums and the Chevelle forums------------------which are also basic Chevy forums, and I see substantially more people with basic mechanical skills there than I do within the Corvette community.
AGAIN, don't misunderstand me, I'm quite happy to help with any mechanical issues when I can---------------in fact, I'm sometimes flattered that people often ask me for help, because I don't really regard myself as much more than shade tree knowledgeable. But, as cool as these old Vettes are, they are REALLY quite simple to service and repair. As mentioned, a good set of Craftsman tools can work wonders on these old cars. And when finished, you have a real work of art!
Oh, and one last comment, it REALLY does help to buy and study the appropriate manuals.
Tom Parsons
05-11-2011, 09:55 AM
#74
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When we are gone.......
Last month we took the 55 over to Redding, Ca. Kool April Nights. The Fri. night cruise was Approx. 5 miles, 1800 cars and was packed with people of all ages. All were really into to it. The enthusiasm was over the top. The impression I walked away with is that when we are gone there might not be as many but there will always be people around who appreciate the cars. Bob
05-11-2011, 04:21 PM
#75
Team Owner
I hate to say it, but as a younger person, I don't think there will be a great demand for classic cars once the baby boomers can no longer own them. I entered my '67 convertible in an NCRS show last summer. At 38, I think I was by far the youngest owner there. I stood there as each team of judges would come up to the car and look around. Finally they'd ask if it was my car. They didn't expect a younger guy to own the car. Except for me, all the owners I saw looked 55+.
Younger people like old Corvettes so I'm not saying large numbers of classic Corvettes will be hauled off to the crusher because nobody wants them. Sure, they'll always be admired and desired. But I am saying that it's NOT the people of the younger generations who are currently paying $30,000+ for these cars. Owning these cars when they were new was just a dream to the boomers when the cars were new. As they aged, they could afford to fulfill that dream and that pushed the prices up.
There are too many other things for most young people to spend our money on... food, gas, housing, insurance, student loan payments, etc. The tax man is taking an ever-increasing share of our decreasing salaries. College tuition for the kids we want to send to college has skyrocketed. So for most of us, a $30,000+ toy sitting in the garage just isn't in the cards.
Also, who works on cars anymore? Heck, who works on anything? Most young people today are much more into playing with computers, ipods, their latest cell phones, etc. to worry about working on an old car.
Of course, the truly valuable and collectible cars will hold their value and appreciate because there will always be wealthy car collectors willing to pay what it takes to add them to their collections. I'm talking about cars like documented and correct '53's, Z06's, '65 fuelies, and '67 L-71's. But who's going to be plunking down $40,000 or $50,000 for a run-of-the-mill driver quality small block in 20 years?? Not the youth of today.
Younger people like old Corvettes so I'm not saying large numbers of classic Corvettes will be hauled off to the crusher because nobody wants them. Sure, they'll always be admired and desired. But I am saying that it's NOT the people of the younger generations who are currently paying $30,000+ for these cars. Owning these cars when they were new was just a dream to the boomers when the cars were new. As they aged, they could afford to fulfill that dream and that pushed the prices up.
There are too many other things for most young people to spend our money on... food, gas, housing, insurance, student loan payments, etc. The tax man is taking an ever-increasing share of our decreasing salaries. College tuition for the kids we want to send to college has skyrocketed. So for most of us, a $30,000+ toy sitting in the garage just isn't in the cards.
Also, who works on cars anymore? Heck, who works on anything? Most young people today are much more into playing with computers, ipods, their latest cell phones, etc. to worry about working on an old car.
Of course, the truly valuable and collectible cars will hold their value and appreciate because there will always be wealthy car collectors willing to pay what it takes to add them to their collections. I'm talking about cars like documented and correct '53's, Z06's, '65 fuelies, and '67 L-71's. But who's going to be plunking down $40,000 or $50,000 for a run-of-the-mill driver quality small block in 20 years?? Not the youth of today.
I also think the NCRS crowd will reduce in numbers. The driver/pro-touring/resto mod area is on the rise and guys in their 30s and 40s are the norm. Plenty of young guys are picking up a wrench or even a welder. My roommate is 29 and fabbed up his own 4 link for his bagged S10 in his mid 20s. If you doubt the kids can turn wrenches move over to the Honda or E30 BMW forums where the guys are swapping motors. They are not playing with old Corvettes due to the price of entry.
Is the car culture and know how, what it was in the 60s or 70s? No but there are still plenty into it. It wouldn't surprise if the cars lost value due to the market interested in buying them shrinking but I think there will be a market. Fuel costs will also have a big impact on this.
05-11-2011, 04:27 PM
#76
Le Mans Master
[quote=93Polo;1577588396]I also think the NCRS crowd will reduce in numbers.[quote]
If they don't create a fertile environment for new younger members. They will fade away with their current membership.
A bunch of crotchety old dudes isn't what I would consider fertile ground.
FYI. Baby boomers income will still be prevalent for another 25 yrs.
At 50 I am at the end of the boomer line.
If the interest in Classic Vettes wanes with the passing of baby boomers? Looks like the NCRS is in serious trouble. They should be working real hard to promote their club to younger folks.
If they don't create a fertile environment for new younger members. They will fade away with their current membership.A bunch of crotchety old dudes isn't what I would consider fertile ground.
FYI. Baby boomers income will still be prevalent for another 25 yrs.
At 50 I am at the end of the boomer line.
If the interest in Classic Vettes wanes with the passing of baby boomers? Looks like the NCRS is in serious trouble. They should be working real hard to promote their club to younger folks.
Last edited by MiguelsC2; 05-11-2011 at 04:51 PM.
05-11-2011, 05:51 PM
#77
Le Mans Master
At car shows I attend (muscle car and Corvette specific....not OPEN) I see NO kids (children of any kind).
At RACES I see entrants of 40 to 50ish, but NO kids (racing is expensive). However, I don't even see kids with parents.....even as spectators! I don't think this bodes well for our hobby. BTW I am probably the youngest guy in my race group!
At RACES I see entrants of 40 to 50ish, but NO kids (racing is expensive). However, I don't even see kids with parents.....even as spectators! I don't think this bodes well for our hobby. BTW I am probably the youngest guy in my race group!
Last edited by 63Corvette; 05-11-2011 at 08:16 PM.
05-11-2011, 06:50 PM
#78
Melting Slicks
The whole thing is much larger than the car hobby. Look at all the other traditional hobby's. Model airplanes (especially building) model rail roading, ham radio and all the rest are going gray. The days are not any longer and the time on the computer, texting, games and high res TV have to come from where.
I just hope the problem is not replaced by the constant search for food and shelter 20 or 30 years from now (or much sooner).
I just hope the problem is not replaced by the constant search for food and shelter 20 or 30 years from now (or much sooner).
05-11-2011, 07:46 PM
#79
Burning Brakes
My car still garners lots of comments from the young crowd. Seems that every time I'm out, a group of kids in a souped up rice rocket pull up beside me to give the thumbs up. The problem I see is if the market doesn't pick up again these things won't be worth restoring correctly given the price of the parts. I scored my '63 #'s match FI (minus the FI unit) for what I thought was a real deal 3 years ago ($33,000 cdn). I decided to do a full resto on it doing all the work myself. I have spend about $40,000 in correct parts (including engine & tranny rebuild) but haven't gotten to the paint and interior yet (although they are quite presentable). I want to sell it now and can't get any interest at 50K even though there is no way you could reproduce this for anywhere near the price unless you got the car for free. Guys are going to stop sinking the money into these for "correct" restorations and just make them into cheaper restomods....
05-11-2011, 08:30 PM
#80
Paid Senior Member
But, I do agree that restomods will live long after the NCRS crowd has faded away. All those correct cars will just be good starting points again.