Joshboody

Hello, I’ve done some reading but thought I’d try the easy out in getting info… by a question thread.

So, in the market for a c5 track car and considering any m6. Of course some are more desirable then others like Z06s, FRC, Z51 coupe. My understanding of the subtle differences below and would love any feedback, correction to my thinking.

Z06: besides the obvious power, MN12, suspension, brakes… also improved PVC evac, power steering cooler, rear brake cooling ducting. How about oil, tranny cooling?

FRC: Also has power steering cooler… but besides this basically just suspension?

Coupe: My thought is that I’d have to change the sway bars, springs, and dampeners… but other than this should be able to take some track flogging? Do I need to worry about any cooling?

Chassis Stiffness: Should I worry about this? Can I stiffen the coupe with various bracings… or no worry until I progress in my tracking skills?

Twisty will be new experience for me, but I do plan to push pretty hard in progressing my skill and hopefully wheel to wheel sometime in the future. So I want something that will be a good base.

Initially I’d love to just get on the track without worrying about mods/refinement. But eventually I’m sure I’ll jump into modding. Engine work/tuning I have good understanding/experience with various platforms, but suspensions stuff I’m a newbie.

Coupe also seems to have a little better headroom than FRC (I’m 6’5”), but I’m sure you can increase it fairly easily with seat/rails.

Thanks for any help.

hellrazr

For a track toy, the Z06 fits the bill (and was designed to do so).

It's lighter, produces more power, and has less unsprung weight than all the others.

There really aren't any modifications necessary for road course track fun, other than a more durable brake fluid. Cooling can be an issue on hot days, but you can add a cooler, or just take a few slow laps when things start to get hot.

If you move to W2W you will absolutely want the Z06, although other vehicle class types might be more competitive.

brkntrxn

While I agree the Z06 is a great car (I race one), I disagree on the Z06 being the car to have for W2W racing. Most race classes In which the C5 Corvette falls into is open enough with the rule sets that there is no advantage to starting with a Z06. It is actually cheaper to start with a base C5, do all of the same modifications, and have a better coefficient of drag with the coupe hatch body style vs FRC.

drivinhard

and a better ratio trans

Hat_Trick_Hokie

Good news is, looking at any C5 is a good base for an occasional track car. I agree with the post above, the Z06 is the best out of the box track-day weapon. Lighter and more powerful than the rest, with a slightly stiffer suspension.

Over the past 3+ years I have driven my stock 2002 Z51 Coupe for 35 track days with no issues. The only mods I have done are track pads, second set of wheels with sticky tires, and a seat/harness combination. These cars are incredible capable stock, and take a great deal of abuse. If you do get a coupe, get a Z51 with the power steering cooler and stiffer springs, shocks, sways.

The only mods you might want to consider (with any trim level) are cooling: engine oil, front brakes, engine water. It’s up to you if the performance of the Z06 is worth the extra $5k, at the time I was shopping (right out of college) it was not.

Good luck with the search!

troyguitar

Z06 is NOT sufficient stock if you are not a beginner. It desperately needs an engine oil cooler and either better front brake cooling or better front brakes - and that's with an intermediate driver on street tires in moderate temperatures.

In hindsight I'd buy a base C5 coupe and spend the $10k difference between it and a Z06 on:

an integrated radiator+engine/trans oil cooler (~$2k), G2 coilovers and decent sway bars (~$3k), a set of 4x speedline Z06 rear tires with 275/35/18 Toyo RA1's ($2k), any good front brake kit from AP Racing, Brembo, Stoptech, etc. (~$3k)

RX-Ben

I don't know how experienced you are, but I think the best route is:
- get a base model coupe (ideally 01 to early 03)
- put Z06 suspension on it, with '04 shocks
- remove the OEM radiator shroud and put a single large fan on it
- install an oil cooler in front of the radiator
- install 2 piece front rotors and good pads
- change out bushings for poly or delrin
- install camber plates
- alignment and cornerbalance
- install a C6Z shifter
- install a seat, harnesses, harness bar and get a head and neck restraint (do this before anything else)
- z51 power steering cooler (very easy and cheap install)
- start with street tires and work your way up
- ditch the AC if you can

That will be plenty fast and easy to drive, you can later do a cam and head swap and headers when you want more.

moespeeds

Or just pick up any C5, and goto the track. Once you get to the point where you need to modify it, the mod you need will be obvious. Harness bar and harnesses should be the first thing you do, but not critical from the start.

RX-Ben

Yes, definitely that too. After a couple sessions with the OEM seat you will want to switch (same goes for the steering wheel) You will obviously need pads and good fluid from the get go.

Joshboody

Appreciate the great feedback. There seems to be about a $5k premium on z06, which can be used to upgrade a base c5. So I take it the extra rigidity is not a big deal.

Years 01-early 03 was mentioned… I think I understand 01+ considering beefier drivetrain and maybe block/pvc design. But what’s different about base 04s?

First action is to get on the track making sure vette is in track condition with maintenance… maybe some trackish pads… from there we’ll see what we need. May need a seat just to fit with a helmet though.

RX-Ben

later '03s and '04s have the revised fuel system which often needs a fix (crossover tube cracks). Not a huge deal though but you need to drop the tanks for the fix.

Bill Dearborn

You can make a great track car by going with the coupe. C5 coupes are plenty stiff on their own (chassis was designed to support a Vert and has plenty of stiffness). The Z06 fixed roof didn't really add that much stiffness (basically the difference is between a clamp in roof and a permanently bolted in roof).

Other than in 97 the Z51 option will get you the power steering cooler (my brand new 97 Z51 didn't get the cooler). Brakes are the same no matter which C5 you have and if you do a lot of track days going to an aftermarket brake setup can save you some operating costs which can help offset the cost of the upgrade. You will need to add engine oil cooling, diff and transmission fluid cooling. A larger radiator with built in EOC works well. The coupe will come with the M6 which has better track ratios than the Z06. Z06 M12 2nd gear ratio is really nice if you are an autocrosser. It is almost perfect. M6 2nd gear is too high and 1st gear is too low.

In summary the differences are:
Aerodynamics - Coupe has better aero and higher speed capability.
Weight -Z weighs less
Suspension - rear spring is stiffer on Z06 and if I remember correctly the front bar on the Z06 is stiffer. Check the C5 facts section to know for sure.
Power - Z has 35 to 60 more depending on which LS1/LS6 combo you compare.
Transmission - Coupe has better ratios (example: Top Speed in 3rd gear in the Z is 102 mph on the stock rev limiter. Top Speed in the Z51 Coupe on the rev limiter is more like 110 mph. Top speed in 4th (same gear ratio) in the Z is 146 on the limiter and in the coupe it will be 137 on the limiter. Bump the power some and add some higher rev capability in the LS1 engine and you will have a car that will reduce the need for shifting and doesn't have the big gap between 3rd and 4th.

Bill

jcsperson

I have decided to forego any further mods to my C5 and plan to sell it in the next year or so and get a dedicated track car. My DD is due for a replacement and I'm going to get a pickup truck to get to work and tow the track car.

As a Corvette owner reported in another thread, "I have a car that is 50% street, 50% track, and 100% nothing." Instead of zorching around in a car with no cage at over a buck fifty, why not sit in a fully-caged car with big brakes and a fuel cell? You can buy these cars ready to rock 'n roll for $16-25K.

lefrog

If you want to save money, get a car that is already prepped and sorted out. It is usually a greater bargain than doing your own build.
Another option is to buy a mildly crashed car in an insurance auction. You can see pictures of mine that was rear-ended at http://frogracing.us/garage/z-frog. An 02 Z06 with 32K miles for less than 10K$ is a great bargain. After all repairs the car did cost me less than 11K$. Now the cost of the race track build is never ending... we'll see where I end up when I'm done!

BryanPendleton

Any of those will work fine. Just get yourself a good clean one that has been cared for and enjoy it. If you have no experience, I would say brake fluid and pads and you are good to go for an HPDE. As you progress in speed, you will outgrow the cooling system. By my 3rd track event in my 01 Coupe, the cooling system was being overtaxed. Got a DeWitts radiator with engine oil cooler staged in my garage to be installed this week. Harnesses and seats, while not absolutely necessary, are unbelievable investments for those looking to really grow their driving skills. My car is used for skills development and daily driving enjoy. I have dedicated crapcan racers for W2W racing, and considering a Spec Miata for club racing.

Joshboody

Thanks for all the input. Made a deal yesterday on a 01 c5 M6 z51 in great shape. Plan is to get it on the track, but this may not happen until fall in AZ. Probably just make sure fluids are good and some decent brake pads initially. Should I swap the rotors also, or wait until necessary? Tires I’ll decide after my first experience.

Also prob get HP Tuner and start logging and learning the tuning aspects. I’d like to convert to E85 eventually… love that stuff. So thinking injectors, pump, cam, valvetrain, but keep the stock exhaust manifolds to limit external heat… and I take it oil pump is easy upgrade if you change cam. Mild mods, but should give a decent bump in HP and slightly higher rpm.

One question I do have is emissions… which its difficult to find this info online. We only do obd 2 plug and test in AZ. If I turn off the DICs and maybe the rear o2s will readiness be active and I’d pass?

brkntrxn

Rotors - keep those rotors on until you crack one. They have been seasoned over and will actually last longer than a fresh one out of the box. Go buy one front and one rear to carry to the track as spares. Don't worry about directional vanes at your skill level. Just get one front and one rear.

E85 - you migh "like" it, but you need to think long term and convienance. I have never seen E85 for sell at a track, nor at a store near a track. You'll go through a tank a day at the track.