NemesisC5

Audi unveils R18 e-tron quattro World Endurance Championship car on streets of Le Man

Car will race with one energy-retrieval system and compete in lowest class of hybrids

Audi implements a new version of the front-axle kinetic system (ERS-K) that it has run for the past two years, drops F1 style system-heat energy recovery and increases displacement from 3.7 to 4.0 liter TDI power.

jcsperson

I hope that none of the guys complaining about the lack of visceral appeal from F1's switch from NA V-8s to turbo V-6s are the same guys who were bemoaning the loss of LMP1 cars in USCC.

It's become an arms race in which only a few competitors can compete. Technology is going to be the ruin of motorsports.

froggy47

Apocolipse

They may be quieter but you have to respect the new engineering going into the systems!!!

mesospeedy

I agree with jcsperson. I think the tech stuff is going to eventually be have a negative effect motorsports. Maybe not a complete disaster, but it affects the racing a lot IMO. It's becoming too much about efficiency and less about speed. For me at least, I think it's a freakin' race car, so who cares if it gets terrible gas mileage! But the flip side of that is with fuel prices and economic bs, they may have to be efficient to keep racing alive, so it's probably something we'll have to live with. As for the hybrid stuff, I dislike the fact that it adds so much hp to the car. It's just one more thing that can go wrong and put a car out or drop performance significantly. I wanna see cars trying to out run each other on track, not being towed to the garage.
I do however like the aero on this years cars. Seems to be a little more trimmed out, so the driver input is bigger with the lower downforce. And who doesn't like watching them kick the tail out a bit on corner exit!
As for the sound...I don't care for it at all. It won't stop me from watching, I still love F1, but it just isn't a good noise. Race cars, no matter what type, should sound unlike anything you hear out of a street car. These sound different, but not nuts! It's like guys running a heads cam LS1 with straight pipes claiming "my car sounds like a NASCAR" (that phrase in itself pisses me off, it's a NASCAR Sprint Cup car, Nationwide car etc. NASCAR is the sanctioning body!) when anybody whose ever heard one up close can vouch for the fact that it is nowhere close!
Ok, rant over, carry on!

varkwso

I will still watch as many F1 races as I can. But the sound is not awe inspiring or visceral.

Apocolipse

You do know that race cars are where most new technology is developed then implemented into our everyday cars right...

Zoxxo

That used to be true much more so than it is today. Lots of modern auto tech was developed for street cars and is not allowed to be used in racing series because they want the driver to play a role in the game. Some of that street tech was used at some point in F1 but not for long as they realized what it was beginning to do to the racing. Look up the Williams FW14

No antilock brakes (road cars first) or traction control (ditto) or automatic transmissions (ditto) are allowed in F1, for example. Pretty much anything that would take away from the driver's role in the race car is banned. (They allow the paddle shifters because it saves the teams a ton of money in transmission rebuilding.)

So, while auto racing has traditional held the role of automotive technical hothouse, it's not so much the case any more as pretty much anything that the engineers come up with that would give their team a rude advantage is nuked on the spot.

Z//

NemesisC5

Many have disparaged quieter engines and reduced noise

Sebastian Vettel believes sound is one of the most important aspects of Formula One racing.

Sebastian Vettel has joined the growing chorus of criticism of the sound made by the 2014 power units.

The German was able to watch the Australian Grand Prix from the pits after his early retirement, and thus had a proper chance to form an opinion.

“It’s ****,” said Vettel when asked in Sepang today. “I think we have to [change it]. I was on the pit wall during the race. It’s better than in a bar! That’s my opinion. I think for the fans it’s not good. I think F1 has to be spectacular, and the sound is one of the most important things.

“I remember when I was a small child, I don’t remember much, but the first time I was about 5 years old, 6 years old when we went to see the cars live during free practice in Germany. The one thing I remember was the sound, how loud the cars actually were, and to feel the cars through the ground. The whole ground was vibrating. It’s a shame that we don’t have that any more.”

Later when speaking in German, Vettel said he would rather have a V12, and that batteries are for mobile phones, not F1 cars.

Meanwhile, Jenson Button had a few words for any drivers criticizing the current rules.

“Go and race something else if you’re not happy,” said Jenson. “As drivers, we don’t have an opinion where the cars are in terms of sound and feel. When you’ve crossed the finish line first and you’ve won a Grand Prix, you don’t care what it sounds or what it feels like. You’ve beaten the best in the world, and that’s what you care about.

quick04Z06

At least the F1 cars are not as ugly as the new Le Mans prototypes. Quiet AND ugly is no way to race through life....

jcsperson

I agree. That's hideous.

RX-Ben

1000hp and AWD might change your mind...

Zoxxo

"Aesthetically pleasing" and "works best" are often at odds.

The WEC cars look the way they do (just like F1 car do) as a result of the rules and aero functionality. The big fin running along the spine of the car is the sports car version of NASCAR's roof flap - it helps keep the car on the ground if it gets sideways. It's mandatory. All the other body shapes are the result of wind tunnel testing. If F1 ran fenders the cars would look pretty much just like the above.

I think they are beautiful in their own, raw "only performance matters" way.

Z//

quick04Z06

Anyone who bothers to post in this section is already familiar with aero "form follows function" arguments and with sanctioning body rules.

These new Le Mans cars are still terribly ugly and the bricklike front fenders fly in the face of all aero in recent years for these cars . All wind tunnel testing and computer modeling 3 years ago was wrong?

This thread was about rule changes hurting F1. Rules mandating a mainsail down the spine of Prototypes for some marginal increase in safety may be doing the same with endurance racing,

Also , when I was at the Petit a few years ago and heard rhe swoosh of the turbo diesel v the roar of the Corvettes, I was not impressed with the diesels. Sometimes a sanctioning body needs to take the fan into account ....

Zoxxo

Really?

Which begs the question, "why would someone with the know-how, capabilities, and racing pedigree of Toyota come up with such a thing - much less implement and display it to the public - if it did NOT work?" Are you an aero engineer? I thought not.

The original post was about how the new *sound* was a negative. So why a pic of a WEC car?

Ah yes, the "marginal increase" in safety that prevents cars at 200+ mph from sailing through the air 50 feet off the ground and into the trees alongside the Mulsanne.

They do. But when the point of the exercise shifts from the competitors winning the races to television ratings and the avoidance of offending any sponsors, you get precisely what we don't want - and what we have in most cases.

FWIW, my own opinion is that F1 cars have been ugly to a fault ever since the high nose stuff started. I accept it as a result of what F1 represents - a technical challenge. But I think that esthetically they are grotesque. I suspect that I'm not alone in this. I also expect that the FIA, Bernie, Montezemolo, Mateshitz, CVC, et al, will point to the cash flow from F1 and suggest that I go attend a car show if I want "pretty."

All of these arguments that pose variations on the basic theory that go something like this:

1. They changed something that I like.
2. They changed it in one or more ways that I do NOT like.
3. I am a representative fan.
4. Given numbers 2 and 3, the enterprise is doomed.

If true then by this time next year F1 will be performing in parking lots at grocery store openings. Bet not.

Be happy that the technical folks in F1 still hold sway over the marketing folks. That's precisely what has made F1 successful over the past 40 years and, I predict, what will keep it so. No matter how much we old-timers like the ground-thumping, ear-splitting racing of yore, that is NOT the future. Get used to it.

Z//

NemesisC5

Mercedes testing new exhaust in effort to restore roar to Formula One engine notes
Team to try new 'megaphone exhuast' system designed to produce more noise

http://www.autoweek.com/article/2014...n=awdailydrive

The lack of noise caused by the new turbo V6s is projected to cause a drop in ticket sales by promoters, as noted in the Eurosport report, who feel the drop in atmosphere will lead to supporters feeling "alienated."

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2...aco-grand-prix

froggy47

Not to get too far off subject, but for 2015, wtf, Baku, Azerbaijan???




http://www.ask.com/maps?sa=Baku%2C+Azerbaijan&q=Baku, Azerbaijan&#YmJxPTEmbXM9c3RyZWV0JmR0PWRy aXZpbmcmbG9jcz1CYWt1JTJDK0F6ZXJiYWlqYW4l N0M=


Drop Korea & add this?

Bernie is just selling F1 to any venue that springs for his price.

Egads.

Zoxxo

First of all, Korea sucked. No one liked going there and, as Bernie pointed out, they failed to deliver on their promises. Good riddance.

That said...

You must not have been paying much attention over the past 15 years or so. Bernie has been selling races to the highest bidder for a long time. And n otice that it's almost 100% to governments where the population has little or no input.

When this topic came up on either the practice or qualifying shows for Spain (I forget which) Hobbs was clearly not impressed and said something to the effect of "So we don't have a French Grand Prix and we still aren't back at Imola but we're going to f****ng Azerbaijan?" (The f****ng is mine but it was in Hobbs' tone.)

Just remember that Bernie is a employee of CVC Capital Partners and it's his job to (a) maintain and grow the cash flow and (b) grow the franchise. All the rest is soppy sentimentality to him (for the most) and certainly to CVC. So no one should be surprised by these kinds of things. Bernie gets the money up front. If the races happens, great. If not, he still has the money and he goes back to his list of people standing in line with cash. A situation I wish that I was in. You too, I bet. :-)

I do agree with Hobbs - they should still be racing at Imola. It's a wonderful track. French Grand Prix? Meh :-)

Z//

BrianCunningham

Racer magazine did an article a while back about the finances of an F1 race

It was rather interesting

They rely a lot on the local government

Zoxxo

Of course. The more "local" they are the more parochial they are and the more effective Bernie's sales pitch can be. The politicos and kings and princes and czars usually aren't having to spend their own money. This has been one of the key issues keeping the United States from having F1 races - American race promoters have this funny idea that someone other than Bernie should get a share off the profits for their efforts and the taxpayers are pretty much unimpressed by anything Bernie says he has to offer. Government folks can be sold on the idea purely from the "marketing your city/state/country to the world" premise and the idea of making a profit isn't even in the picture. Hence Azerbaijan, Turkey, China, Malaysia, Bahrain, Singapore, Russia, etc. where Bernie even gets a healthy share of the track-side vendors' t-shirt sales.

Z//