•► ► CoW BOOSTER - THE MOST AMAZING C6 PRODUCT EVER OFFERED - GUARANTEED! ◄ ◄•
08-17-2011, 06:49 AM
#1
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Thread Starter
Member Since: Nov 2005
Location: Ossining New York
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St. Jude Donor '07-'08-'09-'10-'12-'13-'14
•► ► CoW BOOSTER - THE MOST AMAZING C6 PRODUCT EVER OFFERED - GUARANTEED! ◄ ◄•
"CoW BOOSTER"
THE MOST AMAZING C6 PRODUCT EVER OFFERED
!GUARANTEED!
ATTENTION C6 CORVETTE OWNERS!
The C6 Corvette first appeared back in 2005.
We are all aware of the power improvements GM
made for CORVETTE with the advent of the new and
improved LS series of engines. New for 2005 was
the LS2... in 2006 they unveiled the incredible LS7...
and in 2008 the LS3 made it's first appearance, and
soon to follow would be the SUPERCHARGED LS9 ZR1.
These engines represented huge advances in technology,
reliability, and unmatched performance.
Never before could you order a CORVETTE with the HORSEPOWER
and TORQUE of these new engines.
Given the power output and potential of these new engines
in the last 10 years or so, auto manufactures had no choice but
to replace the old "THROTTLE CABLE AND RETURN SPRING" we were
accustomed to, with something called "ELECTRONIC THROTTLE" or
better known as "DRIVE BY WIRE".
DRIVE BY WIRE was introduced to give auto manufacturers a way to
restrain or regulate the potential power of the latest generation of
engines. In the event the operator of the vehicle could not control
the vehicle, or if the vehicle encountered situations where traction
was compromised (rain, snow, wheel spin, etc) the ON-BOARD
computer would have the ability to over-ride the driver's throttle or
"gas pedal" and safely regulate the power output of the engine where
torque output was reduced to the point that the driver could regain
control of the vehicle.
In addition to the obvious safety concerns, it also gave auto manufacturers
a means to limit operator abuse of their vehicles. In other words,
when the ON-BOARD COMPUTER determined that the operator was
abusing the vehicle, the computer could over-ride the driver's throttle
pedal position and simply regulate the engine's throttle position irregardless
of what the driver did or how far he pushed down on the throttle.
Since the introduction of "ELECTRONIC - DRIVE BY WIRE" throttle
control, I've heard thousands of complaints from drivers wishing that they
had their "OLD THROTTLE CABLE AND SPRING" back. It's commonly
accepted that the "NEW ELECTRONIC THROTTLE" cars feel...
FLAT, WEAK, UN-RESPONSIVE, or MUSHY.
YES, THEY CERTAINLY DO.
Some of you didn't notice...and MANY of you did.
What you likely didn't realize either was that MOST OF YOU OUT THERE
Jump into your C6 CORVETTES every day and the first thing you do
is hit the "TRACTION CONTROL" or "COMPETITIVE DRIVING" button
in the most desperate of hopes and dreams that somehow the
MAGIC button is going to improve the performance of your CORVETTE
beyond the "NORMAL TRACTION/ACTIVE HANDLING ON" mode.
SILLY RABBIT, YOU COULDN'T BE MORE WRONG.
Among other things, what actually happens is that when you select
any other mode
aside from the "DEFAULT" TRACTION ON mode your throttle becomes
SIGNIFICANTLY LESS RESPONSIVE than when you first started
your car.
Don't you feel silly now having pressed that button several million times?
What a cruel joke they played on you....And you fell for it.
Want to know how bad your existing throttle response is???
When you press the gas pedal in your CORVETTE 50% or HALF WAY DOWN
you're actually getting less than 15% of the throttle blade open.
Worse yet, when your taking it easy and only stepping on the throttle
1/4 or
we'll say 25% down, you're actually not getting much more than 3% of
the engine's throttle blade open.
What's really gonna make you upset...
(and EXTREMELY HAPPY AT THE SAME TIME)
is that when you install the new
CORVETTES OF WESTCHESTER
CoW BOOSTER
ELECTRONIC THROTTLE ENHANCEMENT SYSTEM
You're gonna find out EXACTLY how much power you've been missing...
You're gonna KNOW EXACTLY how EXCITING, FUN, and RESPONSIVE
your C6 CORVETTE can be!
When using CoW BOOSTER, you'll be able to press that "silly little button"
and "TRACTION OFF", "COMPETITIVE DRIVING", and "EVERYTHING OFF"
driving modes will have EXACTLY THE SAME LIGHTNING FAST THROTTLE
RESPONSE as the NORMAL TRACTION MODE with CoW BOOSTER.
Better yet, CoW BOOSTER is TOTALLY ADJUSTABLE by US when used in
conjunction with our AutoCal REMOTE TUNING DEVICE or here in our shop.
You can make the throttle SOOOO RESPONSIVE that I guarantee you won't
even be able to drive it, or for those BIG MESSY CAMS that SURGE....
We can simply REMOVE or LESSEN your throttle response to help
prevent your vehicle from bucking.
While MOST CoW BOOSTER installations will make all TRACTION CONTROL
modes function the same, it's also possible to make one mode aggressive
and the other mode feel exactly like stock! ANY WAY YOU LIKE IT!
CoW BOOSTER is NOT a piece of HARDWARE that gets plugged in.
It is a CUSTOM SOFTWARE SOLUTION that took 7 YEARS of
DEVELOPMENT, RESEARCH, and TESTING to become a reality.
It costs about HALF of what other vendors are offering.
It is virtually INFINITELY ADJUSTABLE to SUITE your taste and needs
where the competitor's product only has a few skimpy settings.
It gives you 100% control of your throttle and IS NOT like other products
that simple "FAKE" your gas pedal request to the computer or "skew"
the pedal response.
With other products, the THROTTLE RESPONSE "RESOLUTION" is compromised
giving you much less control than you really need to have.
CoW BOOSTER can be installed and removed without detection or any
trace that it was ever installed.
CoW BOOSTER can NOT BE COPIED, MODIFIED, or INSTALLED by anyone
other than Chuck CoW.
==> If necessary, CoW BOOSTER can easily be removed by almost
ANY tuner or dealership having basic PCM re-flash equipment.
C6 CORVETTE STICK SHIFT & C6 ZO6
C6 CORVETTE AUTOMATIC TRANS
- 100% GUARANTEE -
CoW BOOSTER is GUARANTEED to be the MOST
FUN, EXCITING, and LEAST EXPENSIVE MOD to EVER BE OFFERED
for the 2005 and UP C6 CORVETTE!
AVAILABLE for the FIRST TIME EVER at a
SPECIAL INTRODUCTORY PRICE
at
THE 2011 CORVETTES @ CARLISLE EVENT
Starting Thursday August 25th - Sunday August 28th
(YOU MUST COME TO OUR BOOTH NOT LATER THAN SATURDAY TO ARRANGE FOR SUNDAY INSTALLS)
CoW BOOSTER will only cost $99.
AFTER CARLISLE, the price will be $199.
CoW BOOSTER CAN ONLY BE INSTALLED by CHUCK COW IN PERSON.
YOU MUST BRING YOUR VEHICLE OR YOUR PCM TO THE SHOW.
NO OTHER TUNER WILL EVER OFFER THIS PRODUCT.
NO OTHER VENDOR ON THE FORUM or at CARLISLE can offer a TUNING
PRODUCT AS VALUABLE AS THIS.
DON'T MISS THIS
AMAZING OPPORTUNITY!
THANK YOU!
SEE YOU THERE!
CHUCK CoWLast edited by Chuck CoW; 08-21-2011 at 08:13 PM.
08-17-2011, 07:31 AM
#3
Racer
Chuck, sounds interesting. Can you provide any sort of before and after charts showing the logged movement of the pedal verses the throttle blade, maybe with milliseconds or something? Might be helpful.
08-17-2011, 08:46 AM
#4
Tech Contributor
Chuck, I'm interested.
I have been bellyaching about the C6 throttle for years!
Since 2007....
http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showth...ottle+response
I can't make it to Carlisle...can you set one aside for me at the GREAT introductory rate?
Please let me know. If I love it, I've got a big mouth as you know!
Thanks Chuck for the R&D.
p.s. did you go to Craigster05's gym...or did he pose for that picture?
I have been bellyaching about the C6 throttle for years!
Since 2007....
http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showth...ottle+response
I can't make it to Carlisle...can you set one aside for me at the GREAT introductory rate?
Please let me know. If I love it, I've got a big mouth as you know!
Thanks Chuck for the R&D.
p.s. did you go to Craigster05's gym...or did he pose for that picture?
08-17-2011, 08:59 AM
#5
Race Director
Member Since: Mar 2007
Location: Missouri City Texas
Posts: 11,331
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14 Posts
I had a really hard time following all of that, so what exactly does it do if you claim:
"and IS NOT like other products that simple "FAKE" your gas pedal request to the computer or "skew" the pedal response."
"You can make the throttle SOOOO RESPONSIVE that I guarantee you won't even be able to drive it, or for those BIG MESSY CAMS that SURGE.... We can simply REMOVE or LESSEN your throttle response to help prevent your vehicle from bucking."
I'm also very curious to see any data showing that driving with traction control off actually provides less response than traction control on. I have never heard that before or noticed it when driving and that would be really interesting to see. If that's true then you've stumbled across some interesting information there. I'd like to see the graph showing that.
"when you select any other mode aside from the "DEFAULT" TRACTION ON mode your throttle becomes SIGNIFICANTLY LESS RESPONSIVE than when you first started your car."
If this ACTUALLY provides any performance I'll be excited to try it out for 200 bucks, but I'm thinking this only gives the illusion of performance by making the pedal more sensitive?
If all it does is change the throttle curve like the Sprint Booster than this is at least a much better price and an option for people wanting that.
If undetectable that means there is 0 chance of this voiding a warranty? That would definitely be a plus as well for many "keep it stock" potential buyers.
"and IS NOT like other products that simple "FAKE" your gas pedal request to the computer or "skew" the pedal response."
"You can make the throttle SOOOO RESPONSIVE that I guarantee you won't even be able to drive it, or for those BIG MESSY CAMS that SURGE.... We can simply REMOVE or LESSEN your throttle response to help prevent your vehicle from bucking."
I'm also very curious to see any data showing that driving with traction control off actually provides less response than traction control on. I have never heard that before or noticed it when driving and that would be really interesting to see. If that's true then you've stumbled across some interesting information there. I'd like to see the graph showing that.
"when you select any other mode aside from the "DEFAULT" TRACTION ON mode your throttle becomes SIGNIFICANTLY LESS RESPONSIVE than when you first started your car."
If this ACTUALLY provides any performance I'll be excited to try it out for 200 bucks, but I'm thinking this only gives the illusion of performance by making the pedal more sensitive?
If all it does is change the throttle curve like the Sprint Booster than this is at least a much better price and an option for people wanting that.
If undetectable that means there is 0 chance of this voiding a warranty? That would definitely be a plus as well for many "keep it stock" potential buyers.
Last edited by FloydSummerOf68; 08-17-2011 at 09:50 AM.
08-17-2011, 09:15 AM
#6
Drifting
I had a really hard time following all of that, so what exactly does it do if you claim:
"and IS NOT like other products that simple "FAKE" your gas pedal request to the computer or "skew" the pedal response."
"You can make the throttle SOOOO RESPONSIVE that I guarantee you won't even be able to drive it, or for those BIG MESSY CAMS that SURGE.... We can simply REMOVE or LESSEN your throttle response to help prevent your vehicle from bucking."
I'm also very curious to see any data showing that driving with traction control off actually provides less response than traction control on. I have never heard that before or noticed it when driving and that would be really interesting to see. If that's true then you've stumbled across some interesting information there. I'd like to see the graph showing that.
"when you select any other mode aside from the "DEFAULT" TRACTION ON mode your throttle becomes SIGNIFICANTLY LESS RESPONSIVE than when you first started your car."
If this ACTUALLY provides any performance I'll be excited to try it out for 200 bucks.
"and IS NOT like other products that simple "FAKE" your gas pedal request to the computer or "skew" the pedal response."
"You can make the throttle SOOOO RESPONSIVE that I guarantee you won't even be able to drive it, or for those BIG MESSY CAMS that SURGE.... We can simply REMOVE or LESSEN your throttle response to help prevent your vehicle from bucking."
I'm also very curious to see any data showing that driving with traction control off actually provides less response than traction control on. I have never heard that before or noticed it when driving and that would be really interesting to see. If that's true then you've stumbled across some interesting information there. I'd like to see the graph showing that.
"when you select any other mode aside from the "DEFAULT" TRACTION ON mode your throttle becomes SIGNIFICANTLY LESS RESPONSIVE than when you first started your car."
If this ACTUALLY provides any performance I'll be excited to try it out for 200 bucks.
08-17-2011, 09:47 AM
#7
As DSteck said in the other thread you started, how is your "MAGIC" - that nobody else can do, no tuner in the world has figured out - different from using the electronic throttle section in HPTuners?
Taking your exact words:
Now let's go to the graph I've attached and look at Pedal Position, go to 53%. It says 17% - perhaps 50% is 15% or less. Could this be the area you're modifying? Let's keep reading...
Look at Pedal Position again, specifically 26%. Ah, it says 3 - just as you said. But surely adjusting these in HPTuners can't be done right, because this is a proprietary "CoW" only thing - right?
Honest question - how is it different?
Taking your exact words:
When you press the gas pedal in your CORVETTE 50% or HALF WAY DOWN you're actually getting less than 15% of the throttle blade open.
Worse yet, when your taking it easy and only stepping on the throttle 1/4 or we'll say 25% down, you're actually not getting much more than 3% of the engine's throttle blade open.
Honest question - how is it different?
Last edited by BornSUPERCHARGED; 08-17-2011 at 09:53 AM. Reason: Fixed a typo
08-17-2011, 04:52 PM
#12
Race Director
Sounds good ... I'll stop by Thursday or friday
08-17-2011, 05:07 PM
#13
Le Mans Master
Chuck If only you can install will you be coming to fl anytime soon? Or can it be purchased with your hand held tune? If so what is the wait time frame to get this with the hand held tuner? Also if I ordered today would you honor the $99 price? I want to give this a try along with your hand held tuner..I have a 2011 GS With MXO Trans Only mods are a KB103 With Beehive and a Ported TB...Thanks.
08-17-2011, 05:42 PM
#14
Former Vendor
Thread Starter
Member Since: Nov 2005
Location: Ossining New York
Posts: 11,792
Received 243 Likes
on
183 Posts
St. Jude Donor '07-'08-'09-'10-'12-'13-'14
Bear with me and I'll answer EVERY question that I can....
Bear with me and I'll answer EVERY question that I can....
Yes, In fact, I 've been working on some photoshop images to better describe
the difference and how it works.
Inside of a day or two I'll prepare some graphs for you folks and post them there
with an explanation of what you're looking at.... It's QUITE impressive
and the graphs will clearly show the power and response that was "DE-TUNED"
from the factory.
Hey Joe. You WILL get the amazing price no matter what! You're an
asset to the CORVETTE community and this forum and I appreciate
your willingness to share your info and experiences with others.
I will always help you.
YES, it's been a long time, but for ME, it's been since 2005 when I noticed
that the ETC throttle calibrations were missing and they are missing for a
good reason.
NO, they are NOT Craigster05's weak muscles, They are MY MASSIVE BICEPS!
Hey Floyd....
YES, on the Corvette and many other models the main "TC/ON" default mode
is the most aggressive and ALL OTHER MODES selected with the TC button
are VERY much relaxed. Nobody knows this cause NOBODY can see it.
I absolutely WILL have you some diagrams for you so you can see the
difference. You'll be IMPRESSED.
Please also realize what it does. It DOES NOT increase your WOT TOP END
performance.
What it DOES DO is REPLACES THE MISSING POWER "under the curve" that
GM REMOVED from what could have otherwise been a linear throttle like
as if you had a throttle cable instead of ETC.
More on this later....
Traction OFF or "COMPETITIVE" driving modes won't slow you down as the
upper half of the throttle tables are NOT too far off and don't in any way
"LIMIT" your throttle like on the lower 60% of the ETC pedal response.
This is NOT A TRICK. REMEMBER: These engines DO ACTUALLY
HAVE MUCH MORE POWER earlier in the throttle curve than you know.
It's just that everyone is accustomed to (or has learned to) drive them,
as they are.
We are simple "PUTTING BACK" or RESTORING some of the horsepower down low
that was more or less...."STOLEN" from you.
YES, but my questions to YOU is.... HAVE YOU USED THOSE
TABLES TO INCREASE THROTTLE RESPONSE YET???
I NEVER mind being challenged...Not at all. Fact is, just because they
are displayed there DOES NOT MEAN that they WORK.
Everyone should realize that simply because HP TUNERS shows tables
in their editor software or any other software shows something you can
modify, THAT DOES NOT MEAN THAT THEY FUNCTION.
For instance, Automatics and sticks of the same year might share the
same operating system # and similar engine segments....
In looking at the old LS1 stuff, you regularly see AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION
shift, pressure, and other related tables in tunes recovered from STICK
SHIFT CARS.
You CAN EDIT AND FLASH THEM, but that DOES NOT MEAN that the stick
shift car is going to start shifting AUTOMATICALLY simply because you
can see and edit the tables.
NOW, AGAIN... YOU HAVE PERSONALLY USED THESE HPT TABLES and VERIFIED
that they FUNCTION THE WAY YOU BELIEVE THEY WORK????
Or better yet, any time you like.... You can come here with your vehicle
and your HPT cable and you can demonstrate to me that you CAN control
or better yet, ENHANCE your throttle with the tables you've presented.
When you fail to demonstrate to me that you CAN do it....
I'll be a sport and install the CoW BOOSTER into your vehicle
ABSOLUTELY FOR FREE just cause I'm a sport like that.
UM,... YES. So far as I know and have seen with my OWN HPT CABLE,
you CAN MAKE the throttle LESS responsive.... But NOT BETTER.
I am NOT aware that anyone else can at the moment...and for those that
MIGHT be capable....They are for many reasons....UNWILLING.
My offer to you still stands....
Right now, The options are to see me in person at Carlisle or the shop,
or to send me the PCM. Once CoW BOOSTER is installed, it can
be modified using AutoCal, but for the moment, IN PERSON is the only way.
I am working on a remote solution but it won't likely be available for quite some time.
It was hard enough to get this far.... (7 YEARS
)
YES, if you call me today or tomorrow we'll honor the Carlisle price and you
can send me the pcm when I return from Carlisle.
Same goes for anyone else interested.
Any other questions???
Thank you.
Chuck CoW
Chuck, sounds interesting. Can you provide any sort of before
and after charts showing the logged movement of the pedal verses the
throttle blade, maybe with milliseconds or something? Might be helpful.
and after charts showing the logged movement of the pedal verses the
throttle blade, maybe with milliseconds or something? Might be helpful.
the difference and how it works.
Inside of a day or two I'll prepare some graphs for you folks and post them there
with an explanation of what you're looking at.... It's QUITE impressive
and the graphs will clearly show the power and response that was "DE-TUNED"
from the factory.
Chuck, I'm interested.
I have been bellyaching about the C6 throttle for years! Since 2007....
I can't make it to Carlisle...
Can you set one aside for me at the GREAT introductory rate?
Please let me know. If I love it, I've got a big mouth as you know!
Thanks Chuck for the R&D.
p.s. did you go to Craigster05's gym...or did he pose for that picture?
I have been bellyaching about the C6 throttle for years! Since 2007....
I can't make it to Carlisle...
Can you set one aside for me at the GREAT introductory rate?
Please let me know. If I love it, I've got a big mouth as you know!
Thanks Chuck for the R&D.
p.s. did you go to Craigster05's gym...or did he pose for that picture?
Hey Joe. You WILL get the amazing price no matter what! You're an
asset to the CORVETTE community and this forum and I appreciate
your willingness to share your info and experiences with others.
I will always help you.
YES, it's been a long time, but for ME, it's been since 2005 when I noticed
that the ETC throttle calibrations were missing and they are missing for a
good reason.
NO, they are NOT Craigster05's weak muscles, They are MY MASSIVE BICEPS!
I'm also very curious to see any data showing that driving with
traction control off actually provides less response than traction control
on. I have never heard that before or noticed it when driving and that would
be really interesting to see. If that's true then you've stumbled across some
interesting information there. I'd like to see the graph showing that.
traction control off actually provides less response than traction control
on. I have never heard that before or noticed it when driving and that would
be really interesting to see. If that's true then you've stumbled across some
interesting information there. I'd like to see the graph showing that.
YES, on the Corvette and many other models the main "TC/ON" default mode
is the most aggressive and ALL OTHER MODES selected with the TC button
are VERY much relaxed. Nobody knows this cause NOBODY can see it.
I absolutely WILL have you some diagrams for you so you can see the
difference. You'll be IMPRESSED.
Please also realize what it does. It DOES NOT increase your WOT TOP END
performance.
What it DOES DO is REPLACES THE MISSING POWER "under the curve" that
GM REMOVED from what could have otherwise been a linear throttle like
as if you had a throttle cable instead of ETC.
More on this later....
That all sounds very different. Why do vette owners take all nannies
off at the track and run better times, even myself. Even when I bought new they
said get use to the car first before you start to drive it hard with all on the
off position.
off at the track and run better times, even myself. Even when I bought new they
said get use to the car first before you start to drive it hard with all on the
off position.
upper half of the throttle tables are NOT too far off and don't in any way
"LIMIT" your throttle like on the lower 60% of the ETC pedal response.
This is NOT A TRICK. REMEMBER: These engines DO ACTUALLY
HAVE MUCH MORE POWER earlier in the throttle curve than you know.
It's just that everyone is accustomed to (or has learned to) drive them,
as they are.
We are simple "PUTTING BACK" or RESTORING some of the horsepower down low
that was more or less...."STOLEN" from you.
Look at Pedal Position again, specifically 26%.
Ah, it says 3 - just as you said. But surely adjusting these in HPTuners
can't be done right, because this is a proprietary "CoW" only thing - right?
Honest question - how is it different?
Ah, it says 3 - just as you said. But surely adjusting these in HPTuners
can't be done right, because this is a proprietary "CoW" only thing - right?
Honest question - how is it different?
TABLES TO INCREASE THROTTLE RESPONSE YET???
I NEVER mind being challenged...Not at all. Fact is, just because they
are displayed there DOES NOT MEAN that they WORK.
Everyone should realize that simply because HP TUNERS shows tables
in their editor software or any other software shows something you can
modify, THAT DOES NOT MEAN THAT THEY FUNCTION.
For instance, Automatics and sticks of the same year might share the
same operating system # and similar engine segments....
In looking at the old LS1 stuff, you regularly see AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION
shift, pressure, and other related tables in tunes recovered from STICK
SHIFT CARS.
You CAN EDIT AND FLASH THEM, but that DOES NOT MEAN that the stick
shift car is going to start shifting AUTOMATICALLY simply because you
can see and edit the tables.
NOW, AGAIN... YOU HAVE PERSONALLY USED THESE HPT TABLES and VERIFIED
that they FUNCTION THE WAY YOU BELIEVE THEY WORK????
Or better yet, any time you like.... You can come here with your vehicle
and your HPT cable and you can demonstrate to me that you CAN control
or better yet, ENHANCE your throttle with the tables you've presented.
When you fail to demonstrate to me that you CAN do it....
I'll be a sport and install the CoW BOOSTER into your vehicle
ABSOLUTELY FOR FREE just cause I'm a sport like that.
As DSteck said in the other thread you started, how is your "MAGIC" - that nobody else can do, no tuner in the world has figured out - different from using the electronic throttle section in HPTuners?
you CAN MAKE the throttle LESS responsive.... But NOT BETTER.
I am NOT aware that anyone else can at the moment...and for those that
MIGHT be capable....They are for many reasons....UNWILLING.
My offer to you still stands....
Chuck If only you can install will you be coming to fl anytime soon?
Or can it be purchased
with your hand held tune? If so what is the wait time frame to get this with the hand held tuner?
Also if I ordered today would you honor the $99 price? I want to give this a try along with your
hand held tuner..I have a 2011 GS With MXO Trans Only mods are a KB103 With Beehive and
a Ported TB...Thanks.
Or can it be purchased
with your hand held tune? If so what is the wait time frame to get this with the hand held tuner?
Also if I ordered today would you honor the $99 price? I want to give this a try along with your
hand held tuner..I have a 2011 GS With MXO Trans Only mods are a KB103 With Beehive and
a Ported TB...Thanks.
or to send me the PCM. Once CoW BOOSTER is installed, it can
be modified using AutoCal, but for the moment, IN PERSON is the only way.
I am working on a remote solution but it won't likely be available for quite some time.
It was hard enough to get this far.... (7 YEARS
)YES, if you call me today or tomorrow we'll honor the Carlisle price and you
can send me the pcm when I return from Carlisle.
Same goes for anyone else interested.
Any other questions???
Thank you.
Chuck CoW
08-17-2011, 06:15 PM
#16
UM,... YES. So far as I know and have seen with my OWN HPT CABLE,
you CAN MAKE the throttle LESS responsive.... But NOT BETTER.
I am NOT aware that anyone else can at the moment...and for those that
MIGHT be capable....They are for many reasons....UNWILLING.
My offer to you still stands....
you CAN MAKE the throttle LESS responsive.... But NOT BETTER.
I am NOT aware that anyone else can at the moment...and for those that
MIGHT be capable....They are for many reasons....UNWILLING.
My offer to you still stands....
My question still stands,
how is it different from using that table?
It sounds like you're saying it isn't different,
and you're asking me if I've personally used the table and
did it work
No, I personally have not used it
but I did a quick search and Joe_G
references EFI Live and HPTuners both having a similar table
- and he says it is used and does make a difference.
how is it different from using that table?
It sounds like you're saying it isn't different,
and you're asking me if I've personally used the table and
did it work
No, I personally have not used it
but I did a quick search and Joe_G
references EFI Live and HPTuners both having a similar table
- and he says it is used and does make a difference.
Yes this sluggish response on the tap of the pedal is exactly what I'm talking about. It's a killer if you like to heel and toe downshift like I like to do. Makes it nigh impossible to do and that's no good for road course use. I noticed it the first time I drove my C6 from my C5, the C5 was always snappy.
EFI Live had that throttle rate table for a while now. Pro tuners knew to adjust it on cars that had the factory sluggish rate settings to make the car feel snappy. It's new from January in HP Tuners.
To prove how long and hard I fought this sluggish throttle, look here!
http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showth...response+table
I was trying since 9/07. I knew something was wrong, and tried a lot of things.
Here is what that throttle rate table does - courtesy of Chris at HP Tuners:
the table is called "Throttle Area Increase Rate" and the short help says "This table controls the rate of increase of desired throttle area, set to maximum to disable."
The value is the amount the desired throttle area (the effective area opened by the throttle blade) is allowed to *increase* per "tick" of time within the PCM.
eg. In the ECM drive by wire works roughly like this:
1. Pedal position is measured
2. Pedal position is translated into a requested throttle area % (Driver Demand Throttle)
3. This is arbitrated against all the other allowed throttle requestors, like Cruise Control, Idle and various forms of torque management and failure modes.
4. the lowest is chosen (if nothing else is active then this will be the Driver Demand Throttle)
5. At this point the ECM knows where the throttle wants to move to and also it's current position. It just has to decide how fast to move the throttle from it's current position to the desired position. This is where this table comes in.
6. If the throttle area is *increasing* this table is looked at and the throttle is moved an amount based on the current position and the table value. If it's 1% then it won't move much this "tick". If it's 100% it will probably move directly to the new position (or as fast as is mechanically possible).
7. The amount of time it takes for the throttle to increase to the new position depends on this table. Small numbers take longer, 100% is the fastest.
So it's a ramp rate
The intent of this table is to make the throttle move slower in low speed driving situations or prevent unwanted driveability issues on smaller engined vehicles in higher gears/low RPM.
This is why usually if calibrated this table will have numbers like 1% or 5% at the lower RPM or pedal positions in low gears. Unfortunately for higher powered vehicles it acts as an unwanted traction control. It also removes that nice crisp response you get in a blown car when you snap the throttle at low RPM.
EFI Live had that throttle rate table for a while now. Pro tuners knew to adjust it on cars that had the factory sluggish rate settings to make the car feel snappy. It's new from January in HP Tuners.
To prove how long and hard I fought this sluggish throttle, look here!
http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showth...response+table
I was trying since 9/07. I knew something was wrong, and tried a lot of things.
Here is what that throttle rate table does - courtesy of Chris at HP Tuners:
the table is called "Throttle Area Increase Rate" and the short help says "This table controls the rate of increase of desired throttle area, set to maximum to disable."
The value is the amount the desired throttle area (the effective area opened by the throttle blade) is allowed to *increase* per "tick" of time within the PCM.
eg. In the ECM drive by wire works roughly like this:
1. Pedal position is measured
2. Pedal position is translated into a requested throttle area % (Driver Demand Throttle)
3. This is arbitrated against all the other allowed throttle requestors, like Cruise Control, Idle and various forms of torque management and failure modes.
4. the lowest is chosen (if nothing else is active then this will be the Driver Demand Throttle)
5. At this point the ECM knows where the throttle wants to move to and also it's current position. It just has to decide how fast to move the throttle from it's current position to the desired position. This is where this table comes in.
6. If the throttle area is *increasing* this table is looked at and the throttle is moved an amount based on the current position and the table value. If it's 1% then it won't move much this "tick". If it's 100% it will probably move directly to the new position (or as fast as is mechanically possible).
7. The amount of time it takes for the throttle to increase to the new position depends on this table. Small numbers take longer, 100% is the fastest.
So it's a ramp rate
The intent of this table is to make the throttle move slower in low speed driving situations or prevent unwanted driveability issues on smaller engined vehicles in higher gears/low RPM.
This is why usually if calibrated this table will have numbers like 1% or 5% at the lower RPM or pedal positions in low gears. Unfortunately for higher powered vehicles it acts as an unwanted traction control. It also removes that nice crisp response you get in a blown car when you snap the throttle at low RPM.
FWIW the table I'm referring to is included in the LSx Tuning guide:
http://www.ls2.com/boggs/ls1edit/ls1...ing%20info.htm
Anyone with any experience using that table,
either with no change, worse response or for the better,
is free to chime in.
http://www.ls2.com/boggs/ls1edit/ls1...ing%20info.htm
Anyone with any experience using that table,
either with no change, worse response or for the better,
is free to chime in.
Last edited by BornSUPERCHARGED; 08-17-2011 at 06:42 PM.
08-17-2011, 06:26 PM
#17
Tech Contributor
My Hp Tuners does not have the tables you posted above. There is another throttle rate opening table that it does have.
Look here for more information. Cliff's notes are most cars aren't tuned sluggish from the factory, but 05's are.
http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=21714
Chuck, thanks for the kind words! I might suggest that in your first post you make it a little more clear that this is a solution that currently requires you to be on site to implement. I thought it was a device like the sprint booster. Not everybody's as lucky as me...that you come down to S. FL a couple of times a year!
Look here for more information. Cliff's notes are most cars aren't tuned sluggish from the factory, but 05's are.
http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=21714
Chuck, thanks for the kind words! I might suggest that in your first post you make it a little more clear that this is a solution that currently requires you to be on site to implement. I thought it was a device like the sprint booster. Not everybody's as lucky as me...that you come down to S. FL a couple of times a year!
08-17-2011, 06:40 PM
#18
08-17-2011, 07:26 PM
#20
Procharged F1X 7.18 @ 197
Member Since: Feb 2002
Location: Staten Island NY
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St. Jude Donor '09-'10-'11
My question still stands,
how is it different from using that table?
It sounds like you're saying it isn't different,
and you're asking me if I've personally used the table and
did it work
No, I personally have not used it
but I did a quick search and Joe_G
references EFI Live and HPTuners both having a similar table
- and he says it is used and does make a difference.
how is it different from using that table?
It sounds like you're saying it isn't different,
and you're asking me if I've personally used the table and
did it work
No, I personally have not used it
but I did a quick search and Joe_G
references EFI Live and HPTuners both having a similar table
- and he says it is used and does make a difference.
His table is different probably because his software was older, that post was made on 2009 and the software was updated after that apparently to include the new features/tables.
FWIW the table I'm referring to is included in the LSx Tuning guide:
http://www.ls2.com/boggs/ls1edit/ls1...ing%20info.htm
Anyone with any experience using that table,
either with no change, worse response or for the better,
is free to chime in.
http://www.ls2.com/boggs/ls1edit/ls1...ing%20info.htm
Anyone with any experience using that table,
either with no change, worse response or for the better,
is free to chime in.
I can tell you that it works. I did notice a difference in throttle response. I can tell you it is something he has been working on for quite some time. It is not something that can be done with "off-the-shelf" tuning software. It is a system he designed. For the particulars you have to ask Chuck.
.